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And if more people would have done this, we wouldn't have bans..
Don't forget that complex part about keeping the dog on a leash at the ranger station. Leash + dog + picnic table while you're unloading and rigging. Just so many moving parts and things to put together to make it work! [sarcasm font needed here]
 

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It leveled off from what I have seen, around 2010, and ramped back up around 2018, with the current explosion IMHO COVID related. Judging from the permit statistics I've seen, we're likely at the "300 interested users" level of growth. The fact that companies like DRE are months behind making their gear, I'd say we'll be at 500 soon enough.
Crazy that all outdoor sports are getting hit. Indoor/organized recreation is generally cancelled, so people still want to do something.
Bikes get ordered in the summer for the coming spring. Retailers (including Walmart) were entirely sold out of bikes by April.
 

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Crazy that all outdoor sports are getting hit. Indoor/organized recreation is generally cancelled, so people still want to do something.
Bikes get ordered in the summer for the coming spring. Retailers (including Walmart) were entirely sold out of bikes by April.
Walmart sells bikes? I got a call from my Harley dealer 3 days ago trying to get me to buy a new bike, apparently they have plenty
 

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Well if you meant bicycle, why didn't you say bicycle? bikes are generally ridden by bikers, who wouldn't be caught dead in Lycra, instead favoring leather...
 

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About 20 years ago I decided to run the Deschutes without a permit (was totally unregulated in those days, but you still had to pay the $15)

Was sitting in camp after sundown, drunk and buck nekked with a blonde girl sitting on my lap....ya know.
Saw a tan boat float by...but was.... preoccupied...

Until the nice Trooper walked up the trail.
I asked him to excuse me while I had blondie get my shorts off the line(they needed to dry...) and so my drunk ass could get decent.
He turned his back, mentioning that he understood that these things happen on the river.

Anyhoo, although he did write me a ticket for running without a permit, it was one of the more pleasant experiences I've had with a LEO.
As he was leaving, I said "I'd offer you a beer if you weren't on duty...."
"If I weren't on duty I'd accept".
 

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Discussion Starter #50
Thanks for all contributions on this thread...no doubt, poaching river time has crossed my mind at times when I end up without a permit most years. I have no intention of going down that road of being sneaky on rivers without a permit and have never have done so. Not sure it would be a thrill of dodging the law anyway more like a big time nuisance. I fully appreciate limits to protect the environment that we all love but I struggle with how many permits go to outfitters and how overpopulated the rivers are (and the world) ...the pay to play system seems like another hook-up for folks who have more money than most. Maybe not - I just wish the world was still more wild. I am open to hearing more solutions and am morbidly curious about the trails of pirates. Besides all that, thanks for all the tales of river drama and I appreciate the LNT approach and conservation focus that the rangers and regular folk of the public have brought. We all go off duty sometimes and that's where the stories lie,,,thanks for sharing and keep em coming. Keep it safe...keep it secret, Thanks Buzz.
 

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No rangers, no permits, here in Humboldt County. Cal Salmon, Smith, Klamath, Trinity, Van Duzen, and Ell.
Rangers have always seemed like boyscouts that all of the sudden had guns and were out to write as many tickets and catch as many bad guys as possible. My wife, 3 yr old, and I were stopped at a low pass in Yosemite once due to snow on the road. Stopped just behind the ranger waiting for the ok to move on. Gets out of his rig, comes over to talk with us, cause he's a nice guy. The whole time he peers into every nook and cranny looking for a way to bust us. Efd up.
Last time someone I knew snuk onto a river was the Rouge back the 80's. August, low water. They rowed the entire scenic in one day. 40 miles. Camped on the ramp and as soon as they could see started rowing.
 

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We were floating Ruby Horsethief a few years ago (with a permit). Our buddy Shaun was the ranger at the time. We coordinated an afternoon for him to meet up with us at camp to play a few tunes. He motored up with a dad and two kids in his boat and was dragging their raft behind his. It turns out they didn't have a permit, so he was motoring them to the takeout to send them on their way. I'm not sure what kind of penalties they got, but they sure felt awkward sitting in the ranger raft while he hung out with us for 15 minutes at camp.
 

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We were floating Ruby Horsethief a few years ago (with a permit). Our buddy Shaun was the ranger at the time. We coordinated an afternoon for him to meet up with us at camp to play a few tunes. He motored up with a dad and two kids in his boat and was dragging their raft behind his. It turns out they didn't have a permit, so he was motoring them to the takeout to send them on their way. I'm not sure what kind of penalties they got, but they sure felt awkward sitting in the ranger raft while he hung out with us for 15 minutes at camp.
Ruby does not require a permit to float, just to camp. Did they poach a camp, and if so, which one? Is it poaching a camp if you stop at one during the day without a reservation for it?
 

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Ruby does not require a permit to float, just to camp. Did they poach a camp, and if so, which one? Is it poaching a camp if you stop at one during the day without a reservation for it?
That's a good question. I'm not sure. He met up with us later in the afternoon and I think we were maybe staying at Mee Corner, so perhaps they were running out of time to make it to Westwater before dark.
 

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Ruby does not require a permit to float, just to camp. Did they poach a camp, and if so, which one? Is it poaching a camp if you stop at one during the day without a reservation for it?
True, and a very good point. You can stop at a camp and have lunch, you just can't camp there
 
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