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Managed to pick up a Hells Canyon 7/12 after the permits were delayed for a full hour (went live at 9am). I scrolled past June and into July and almost every day had an available permit. Deso and Dino had tons of dates available too, though I didn't score any of those. The point. Who are these a-holes that are entering lotteries and selecting SPECIFIC DATES only to not accept their permits? I know shit comes up and trips get cancelled but the sheer number of permits popping back up make you wonder who these people are that are applying for permits they have no intention of using.
 

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No excuses for rec.gov, but wonder if the time change had anything to do with the IT problems?
Realize that was over the weekend....
 

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Honestly the best thing to do is find the forest service district ranger and start making calls complaining about how this occurred. If enough calls are made they will change how rec.gov is doing things. Complaining to rec.gov does nothing. For the NFS it’s the Middle Fork Ranger District in Challis, Hells is the NRA office in Clarkston. Looks like the mainl and Selway permits went out the way they were suppose to.
 

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I feel like instead of doing this mad dash click fest that benefits those with good computers and fast internet that rec dot gov does.... doing follow up lotteries like they do in the Grand would be more equitable.

I'd also support an automatic lottery system that basically takes all the people who applied for that day in the original lottery and randomly chooses one of them when someone declines/cancels a permit.

This would basically stop the bots in their tracks as well.
 

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Somebody is asleep while their bot keeps releasing and immediately picking up August 18th every 15 minutes...I've seen it three times now and it is taken before I can click on it, then reappears 15 minutes later...
Insanity: Doing the same thing over and over again and expecting a different result.
 

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Honestly the best thing to do is find the forest service district ranger and start making calls complaining about how this occurred. If enough calls are made they will change how rec.gov is doing things. Complaining to rec.gov does nothing. For the NFS it’s the Middle Fork Ranger District in Challis, Hells is the NRA office in Clarkston. Looks like the mainl and Selway permits went out the way they were suppose to.
I like this idea. If enough people are making the phone ring off the hook, we might make a solid change.
 

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Honestly the best thing to do is find the forest service district ranger and start making calls complaining about how this occurred. If enough calls are made they will change how rec.gov is doing things. Complaining to rec.gov does nothing. For the NFS it’s the Middle Fork Ranger District in Challis,
Old school LETTERS are really helpful to agencies and federal contractors (BooseAllen) that need a reminder to step up their performance. Don't forget to cc your senators and rep in congress.
 

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Discussion Starter · #50 ·
Not to say that helpful suggestions aren't warranted, but assume this issue would be pretty low on a priorities list. For you "young bucks & does" you have time to work on it. For me I am just getting what I can (legally) before I term out.
 

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The first thoughts that a buddy and I had were, these repeated failures to do what they say they will made us feel like hiring lawyers. There are enough of us that take issue with how things are run that it feels like, from a total non-expert, that could be grounds for a class action suit.
I feel like this is a logical next step. I had a very frustrating call with Rec.gov over a different issue and with the same rep was told multiple different lies that she went back on more than once. They have monetized this as they have perverse incentive to do so(the fees they rake in). They also run the booking system for MANY state recreation sites including City Of Rocks in Idaho among others. Needless to say it is a mess as well and rife with fees and penalties etc. They have piss poor customer service which leads to poor user experiences ALL the time. understand you can ot please all the people all the time but this is unacceptable by most any standard.
 

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U/Dangerfield: Not to say that helpful suggestions aren't warranted, but assume this issue would be pretty low on a priorities list. For you "young bucks & does" you have time to work on it. For me I am just getting what I can (legally) before I term out.
This attitude is what got us to where we are in the world today. The older generation deciding they don't care what their legacy is("I got mine, you worry about getting yours"). I am not sure how old you are but this is a sad viewpoint to take. We all need to make sure we look out for anyone that comes behind us. Whether it is making sure you did all the proper prep work for then next shift of employees coming in in the morning to making sure that the earth is not an inhospitable mined out resourceless shithole after you go tits up.

Edit to add quote.
 

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Discussion Starter · #54 ·
This attitude is what got us to where we are in the world today. The older generation deciding they don't care what their legacy is("I got mine, you worry about getting yours"). I am not sure how old you are but this is a sad viewpoint to take. We all need to make sure we look out for anyone that comes behind us. Whether it is making sure you did all the proper prep work for then next shift of employees coming in in the morning to making sure that the earth is not an inhospitable mined out resourceless shithole after you go tits up.

Edit to add quote.
Nobody on this site personally know's who I am and thus would not know my contributions/legacy for the "greater good". Possibly nobody would want to walk in my shoes. I'll leave it there.
 

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I will say a lawsuit has come to mind. This has happened several times now over the last few years. The folks in my group are wondering how many of the rec.gov "friends and families" were smart enough to check for permits yesterday and at midnight. I had my alarm set to log in this morning at 7:50A and never thought to start trying to grab permits before 8:00A. I am very frustrated. As a person that writes code for a living the mistakes are difficult to fathom as screw ups such as these guys have experienced (or purposefully created) are very difficult to do. DB interface and actual date/time functions are basic programming knowledge and I cannot understand how such mistakes are actually mistakes.
 

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This attitude is what got us to where we are in the world today. The older generation deciding they don't care what their legacy is("I got mine, you worry about getting yours"). I am not sure how old you are but this is a sad viewpoint to take. We all need to make sure we look out for anyone that comes behind us. Whether it is making sure you did all the proper prep work for then next shift of employees coming in in the morning to making sure that the earth is not an inhospitable mined out resourceless shithole after you go tits up.

Edit to add quote.
You are 1/2 right. The other 1/2 is that the young people coming up just do not respect the work that was played out by the previous generations just to get to the point we are at today. So, I propose there is a middle ground where the young take some responsibility and stop blaming everyone for your own personal problems.

Don't forget that it was my generation that protected the wild rivers you so love to run. I was my generation that stopped people from pooping in the river. I can go on and on.... The young people today are literally walking over the dead bodies of previous generations to enjoy the freedoms YOU have today.

So, - sit down #!%&# be humble!
 

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Not a code issue. Someone (guessing someone at the issuing rangers office) fumbled something in the admin interface. Either they set the lottery release time to be yesterday at 4pm, or accidentally released the cancel dates at that time.

Mistakes happen. There's not much to be done about it now, and it's not like waking up at 8am is any sort of a guarantee that you'll land a permit anyway.
 

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Not a code issue. Someone (guessing someone at the issuing rangers office) fumbled something in the admin interface. Either they set the lottery release time to be yesterday at 4pm, or accidentally released the cancel dates at that time.

Mistakes happen. There's not much to be done about it now, and it's not like waking up at 8am is any sort of a guarantee that you'll land a permit anyway.
This is not the first time (or even the second time) they have messed it up. However, due to whatever type of mistake...again...my odds of picking up a permit at the scheduled 8:00A time went from bad to zero. I think that line of thinking is invalid.
 

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This attitude is what got us to where we are in the world today. The older generation deciding they don't care what their legacy is("I got mine, you worry about getting yours"). I am not sure how old you are but this is a sad viewpoint to take. We all need to make sure we look out for anyone that comes behind us. Whether it is making sure you did all the proper prep work for then next shift of employees coming in in the morning to making sure that the earth is not an inhospitable mined out resourceless shithole after you go tits up.

Edit to add quote.
That’s a boat load of assumptions there about someone who you have no idea about. I could say that the social media trend of knee-jerk responses about things that the poster knows nothing about have also lead us to where we are now as a fucked up society… but then I start running the risk of making a boat load of assumptions about you. See how that feels?
 
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