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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
Hi. Mouse chewed a hole in my Achilles Expedition raft. It's been in storage for 5 years so got it out to prep for the Grand next spring and dammit. Just one hole, about .05 cm diameter. The problem is, the patch keeps getting a bubble and eventually the bubble works its way to the edge and it's leaking again. I thought it was the old thick shore cement so yesterday peeled it all off, lightly sanded again, and placed a new patch with a new batch of cement. Happened again. Is it too hot? Maybe sun expansion put too much pressure on the patch before it was cured? Been hitting >80 F up here in the mountains. Any ideas?
 

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Discussion Starter · #3 ·
.05 cm is pretty tiny. :)

Better prep, bigger patch, thinner layers of glue, Stabond.
Oops, typo, it's 0.5 cm! The prep was excellent, the patch really big (about 5x7"), the glue layers (3) quite thin. But not Stabond.
 

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I knew what you meant, just giving you some hell. 5x7 is plenty big enough patch. I would likely use a 4" maybe 5" round on that. It can be hard to get Shore on super thin. Three coats can really build up and compromise bond if its not thin enough. Shore is good glue but is fairly prep picky. You might try Stabond and see where you get. Let it cure before pumping. Typically if there is much missing material I do an inside patch but half centimeter is small enough that it wouldn't warrant that.
 

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I knew what you meant, just giving you some hell. 5x7 is plenty big enough patch. I would likely use a 4" maybe 5" round on that. It can be hard to get Shore on super thin. Three coats can really build up and compromise bond if its not thin enough. Shore is good glue but is fairly prep picky. You might try Stabond and see where you get. Let it cure before pumping. Typically if there is much missing material I do an inside patch but half centimeter is small enough that it wouldn't warrant that.

Zach,

Unrelated Question:

Do you prefer Stabond to Clifotons? This summer I experimented with Cliftons and I liked the fact that you can run a damp rag of toluene over your 3 layers of glue to get a nice tacky consistency for large patches, wear strips, etc.

Am I a fool?

Any reason I should go back to Stabond other than it is an universal glue to keep in the patch kit?

For rubber reference: I have an 82' Avon that I still run in the Grand so I give it TLC to keep er' goin.
 

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Clifton makes several glues so I am not 100% sure which one you are talking about. The answer is, if the glue is working for you and you are happy with working with it, its a fine glue. I use Stabond on my 86 Avon which has the same material as your 82. One of the best repairs guys around doesn't love Cliftons 4844 for the old Avon material and it may not be the BEST glue for it but it works with a good prep job. Stabond may not be the BEST glue for it either but it works great for me. It is a super versatile glue that works with about everything and is fairly easy to work with (at least for me) which is why I typically recommend it for repair kits along with a roll of tear aid. If you have Stabond and a guy on your trip has a PVC boat that he blows a huge rip in, you have him covered. With Clifton 1065 (Shore adhesive), not so much.
 

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Clifton makes several glues so I am not 100% sure which one you are talking about. The answer is, if the glue is working for you and you are happy with working with it, its a fine glue. I use Stabond on my 86 Avon which has the same material as your 82. One of the best repairs guys around doesn't love Cliftons 4844 for the old Avon material and it may not be the BEST glue for it but it works with a good prep job. Stabond may not be the BEST glue for it either but it works great for me. It is a super versatile glue that works with about everything and is fairly easy to work with (at least for me) which is why I typically recommend it for repair kits along with a roll of tear aid. If you have Stabond and a guy on your trip has a PVC boat that he blows a huge rip in, you have him covered. With Clifton 1065 (Shore adhesive), not so much.

But we all thought YOU were the best repair guy around.. Thanks Zach.
 

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Discussion Starter · #8 ·
But we all thought YOU were the best repair guy around.. Thanks Zach.
Just to finish off, my problem seems to be solved. When the bubble started up under the second patch, I pressed it all flat again and left the tube limp for another 36 hours. This time the glue directly over the hole cured and the tube now holds pressure just fine. Moral: watch out for sun heating up tube while glue not fully cured!
 

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I've been asking about glues lately as well and wasn't stoked on my first go with stabond as it was thickening up too fast.

But I did another few small jobs with it today and I put a tight sealing cap on in between small jobs and it stayed viable for a lot longer than my first try.

I'm coming around to it and do like the versatility of working on PVC and hypalon.

Quick side question... can someone explain to me what variable affect the timelines on how long between coats? So far every time I do any glue work, the glue is ready for the next coat (or placing the patch) even before the low end of the recommended time. This is based on the knuckle test, and I've found this with every glue I've used, which is Clifton urethane, Clifton 4844, and stabond.

My local weather is usually around 40% humidity and it doesn't get all that hot... today was maybe 78F.

So far I haven't had anything I've glued come up so I assume I'm doing it right... just curious.
 

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Nope, there are a few guys around that have forgotten more about it then I hope to ever know. Whether that is due to fumes or not....... They are all mostly retired from the business though so you gotta take what you can get!


Cupid, waiting longer between coats is no problem. The glue bonds to itself just fine assuming you aren't letting it fully cure (and even that is fine in some cases). It is often that I let the first coat sit for hours. Typically coats 2, 3 get done a little closer together. If your patches are working don't overthink it.
 
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