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Discussion Starter #1
I know its tribal lands and probably not legal to run, but looks doable from many parts of the highway up. Any buzzards have any beta,storys,pictures?
It looks super burly and looks like it would go even with really low water.
 

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nope. not to say it hasn't been done, but it's unlikely your going to get anyone to admit to it. i wouldn't risk it personally.
 

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Discussion Starter #5
Thats a shame.. for us. From what ive seen from climbing in that area with a powerful pair of binocs ,theres some really stout boating in there. But doesnt sound worth the risk.
Any other AZ suggestions? other than the ones in the book.
 

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Upper salt above 60 has been done plenty of times. Yes the water is stout and yes you have to poach. There used to be a write up on coloradokayaking.com but can't seem to find it now.

The Black also has close to 100 miles of gorged class IV and is good to go at 300-500 cfs. Good luck dealing with those Apaches. They must be grumpy from not paying taxes and all the free college they get. Try calling them and getting the same answer or person twice.
 

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Upper salt above 60 has been done plenty of times. Yes the water is stout and yes you have to poach. There used to be a write up on coloradokayaking.com but can't seem to find it now.

The Black also has close to 100 miles of gorged class IV and is good to go at 300-500 cfs. Good luck dealing with those Apaches. They must be grumpy from not paying taxes and all the free college they get. Try calling them and getting the same answer or person twice.
I Cannot imagine why they are grumpy...
 

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I have heard that this is one of the best whitewater runs in Arizona. Rumor has it the run is class V and there are 3 portages at higher flows (2000+ cfs), fewer portages with regular flows (1400ish). Seal-launch portages are supposedly common. Access is interesting. Fishing permits are recommended. Looks like a great place to go for walled in whitewater.

Rumor has it that write up was taken down after a heavy dose of hate mail was received... not from authorities, but from Arizona paddlers that didn't want beta shared.
 

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This is a stellar run at all kinds of different flows. Below 500 cfs the sieves really come out. There's an easily traveled dirt road to a bridge (put-in) providing access. 7-8 miles of read/run grade IV in a beautiful walled in canyon warm you up for the goods below. Bring a solid group and be ready to scout. This is the best run in AZ.
 

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Discussion Starter #11
I saw a little of it at around 350 a couple weeks ago and it looked totally boatable.
Im not gunna poach but id like to hear more from people. Im going to start making calls to see if a permit or wriiten permision is a possiblity.
Any beta on that 100 miles of gorge class iv on the black???
 

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I have run the Salt below Hwy 60 a number of times and it is one of my favorite runs.

Have looked at those drops from the hwy turn offs above the bridge and they look awesome. I don't have the skills to run that section but would love to back pack the area.

Does anyone know if there is a trail along any parts of that section? Looks pretty vertical from the hwy turn offs.
 

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Discussion Starter #14
Anyone know how long that run is? Looking at google earth it seems to go on for a long way .What are the portages like ? roped descents? theres a set of falls the you can see on g earth that seems to go on for ever? its like black canyon meets gore in the desert!
 

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Dwave, A very good friend of yours paddled about 60 miles of it and was working on trying to open it up but got fed up with the inconsistencies of the apaches. He told me there was about 100 miles of III-IV, and 40 were great and fairly easy to access. I have not boated it, just repeating what he found.
 

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Discussion Starter #16
theres a primitive road that runs along side for a long time.. but who knows a primitive road on indian land could mean need a rockcrawler..
Guess it doenst matter if you cant boat it legaly. Ive already tried a couple phone calls to no avail.. this will be a tough nut to crack.
 

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Discussion Starter #17
upper salome looks just as enticing ,but you"d really have to time the flow right..
Anyone have any thoughts on it? other than the jug (which i have boated ) .
 

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I Cannot imagine why they are grumpy...
<sarcasm>Seriously, it has been like years since the genocide and theft of their land. Get over it already! I am sure all that casino revenue means they all drive Cadillacs and live in big fancy houses....</sarcasm>

I know it is a bummer that there are boating/climbing restrictions on a lot of res land, but it is their land. Period.

I do wish more tribes would be more open to some sort of permit system, but it takes resources to implement. Unless they are convinced that revenue would be enough to support management it is easier just to keep it closed.
 

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Don't bother trying to kayak upper Salome. The first descent was one too many. huckinhuge used to have a writeup.
 
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