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Kill the Rattlesnake or Let It Go

Rattlesnakes; Kill or Let Live

32K views 122 replies 61 participants last post by  swimteam101 
#1 ·
In a recent thread someone posted they had scratched a MFS camp off their list of camps due to a snake lying on the trail to the groover. The snake was destroyed in favor of the people in the camp. My personal feeling is move the groover, find another camp, whatever, let the snake go about his business.

Snakes are really cool organisms when you consider what they are all about and they hang out where there is a ready food source. Sloppy camp manners, dropping food scraps and garbage onto the ground attracts mice and rats into river camps inviting a hungry snake come around looking for an easy meal.

What's the feeling of the buzzard crew about the question of kill or not?
 
#4 ·
Not.

I don't like snakes at all, especially venomous snakes, so I'm not getting close enough to kill it anyway! LOL

Even so, I've seen one once near a camp, and we just left it alone and made sure we gave it plenty of space (no part of our camp was set up anywhere near it).

I think if you stay in the main parts of the camp, keep camp clean, and give them their space, they'll return the favor and give you yours. I don't think they want any part of you either...
 
#14 ·
As long as you eat them, it's ok to kill them. They're a little chewy though.
I with Tony on this one. They taste like chicken with a little bite.:rolleyes:

I'm mean, like, totally! ... ....... kill every single..... ...... wolf

I also agree with Marko except I wont eat wolf. They taste like bark and are ruff on my digestive system:?
 
#11 ·
Ever heard of the Frank Church / River of No Return Wilderness area?
It's only the second largest protected wilderness in the entire United States.. And the Middle Fork of the Salmon passes through the heart of it.
Lots of wilderness in beautiful Idaho...
 
#12 ·
In a recent thread someone posted they had scratched a MFS camp off their list of camps due to a snake lying on the trail to the groover. The snake was destroyed in favor of the people in the camp.

What's the feeling of the buzzard crew about the question of kill or not?
I'm in total agreement with this person. I'm mean, like, totally! We should not only kill every single snake, ant, bee, fly, wolf, bear and whatever other specimen that may interfere with MY sanitized experience in the wilderness, but also go in and install concrete patios and walkways that service river areas with plumbing, hotels, air conditioning, bars, cable, wireless service, and any and every possible consumer goods product that can service the needs of MY experience in the wilderness. Because when I am in the wilderness it is about ME, and MY sanitized experience and safety, dammit! And I WILL find an attorney who will sue whoever, or whatever, if I so much as get a mosquito bite! And while we are at it... could somebody PLEASE start altering the rapids on these rivers to make it easier for MY safe experience on the river! Gosh, how rude that these little critters would intrude upon MY experience in the wilderness!

(sarcasm alert!... for those who may not be adept in catching that kinda thing ;))
 
#15 ·
This thread took a dive. Lots of people have no sense of humor whatsoever. Everyone knows you're not in the wilderness when you to get camp, especially in ID, AND, snakes only live in the wilderness. What the f%#k was a snake doing there!
 
#17 ·
Seriously?

Attempting to kill a rattlesnake puts yourself in way more danger than ignoring it. This is not about survival when you have a cooler full of steaks and beer. Killing any creature just because it is in your path says more about one's respect for life than anything else. I hope common sense prevails over fear when presented this scenario.
 
#19 ·
I've run in to quite a few rattle snakes in the past decade (apparently AZ has a few of them slithering around the state) and have been within 2ft of them before noticing the, either because of the rattle (extra underwear required) or just noticing them before stepping on them (some studies show that they rattle less and less when people walk by).
Never been bit or attacked. They don't like humans more so than humans don't like them. Never heard of a rattler approaching a human on purpose. They're neat from a safe distance! And they are cross breeding with different rattlers so its hard to tell if one has the neurotoxin or not.
I killed a baby rattler when I was 14 because it was a 2ft wide path with steep drops on each side. We ate it, and made a small belt out of it. Not too proud of it, but many others things I'm less proud of during my adolescence ;)
 
#22 ·
If you have ever had to deal with a member of your party being bit by a rattler you all might have a different attitude. I have seen them hide in inconspicuous places, striking with no warning. Use caution in rattlesnake terrain. I almost lost a friend to one and did lose a great dog who had been my companion for a decade. I don't like to harm any creature, but I would rather see a dead snake than a dead friend or pet.
 
#24 ·
I used to work as a wild land Fire Fighter.
Twice I killed Rattlers that were next to homes.
The multiple other times I left them alone.

In a river camp I would slice and dice.

A friend got bit by an Oregon rattler on the thumb. (He was not handling the snake.) His thumb swelled incredibly and eventually blew up, (literally), in a doctors face. It took a different great Doc to save it.
A key point here is the different toxicities of rattlers in different parts of the US. It should be noted that in the SW or Southern States that thumb injury could be death. Caveat. People do die in the NW but more often its lost fingers.

=======

This list is incomplete; you can help by expanding it.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_fatal_snake_bites_in_the_United_States
 
#26 ·
This is a heated topic in Oregon. Or at least between the people in Oregon I know. Many are on both sides. I am personally on the side of leave it alone and go about your business because that is easier then trying to kill and dispose of the snake. Others however carry guns and bird shot to kill them when they see them. A few guides on the Deschutes are in this camp. Honestly I understand their position. Often the snakes on the Deschutes are on or near paths used by many people and often people and kids that are in flip flops and have little understanding of the danger. People that kill in that area do it to avoid another person coming down that trail later and getting bit. If a snake has to die to save a child, dog or another adult I understand but I would not kill the snake myself.
 
#29 ·
We had an experience with rattlers on Ruby / Horse Thief. We were 5 families, 7 kids under 7 years old and 2 dogs. We pulled into camp and one showed up as we set up. I got a stick and moved it back up river to the next cottonwoods group (ones with water bucket). I came back to camp and there was another making it's way through camp. I moved it to. We ate, and as it got dark, were trying to get kids in bed, when another came in to the kitchen area. This one would not be caught and moved. It was pined with an oar and the head chopped off. Did I like doing it, No. Western diamond backs are not an endangered species, so it was not illegal. I killed it on the basis that it was more dangerous in camp , at night than it would be for me to move it and risk being bitten by one that I did not see. If that makes me an asshole, then so be it. The safety of my family and friends trumps any belief in the wilderness / leave no trace ethic. I now believe that just as in river safety, every situation is different for different people.
 
#38 ·
Western Diamondback? They don't have habitat in Colorado or Utah:

Utah Division of Wildlife Resources
Snakes of Colorado - Colorado Herping
Crotalus atrox - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Why this matters? Its pretty common for people to assume the worst possible outcome with rattlesnakes and in this case assuming its a western diamondback means confusing a local snake with one that does kill the most people in the US.

Only about 10 people a year die from snake bites in the US, not much of a concern. As well, even when bitten most people survive, though the toxins can leave short term and long term damage.

Most bites and deaths come from people who intentionally handle or provoke snakes. So actually killing a snake increases the risk of harm and potentially death to someone in your party. This is especially true for the most venomous of snakes in the country that tend to be very aggressive. Ironically these are not the ones most of us encounter.

Here is a case study of Utah deaths:

https://ojs.lib.byu.edu/spc/index.php/wnan/article/viewFile/28539/27002

(That is 5 rattlesnake deaths in Utah (though one was in AZ actually) over 91 years.)

Obviously, to each their own. But there is a lot of misunderstanding and poor education out there regarding which species are a major concern and its all too common for people to wrongly identify them.

And ironically....your group has a higher risk of someone dying from an undiagnosed allergy to bee stings than a snake bite. Talk about a worry on places like the Main Salmon (sarcasm)....even with twice as many deaths its still a minuscule risk. We've lost more people on rivers to alcohol recently then any of these concerns and we are rightfully not trying to eradicate from our journeys.

Phillip
 
#31 ·
I think its funny that people are all up tight about killing rattle snakes. I would have never guessed! A lot of Buzzards in the thread are all "you have no respect for life" and shit. But truth is that their daily lives indirectly kill 100's of species and they don't even care because they distance themselves. They justify driving cars and floating plastic boats and cooking on propane stoves or using hydraulic electricity. Its complete bs. These people need to remember that when you start pointing your finger at people there are 3 more fingers on your own hand pointing right back at you. If you know what I mean???
 
#37 ·
Are you addressing AMERICANS?

Really.

Well, maybe just the ones who have mercenaries kill food for them that is sanitized in plastic.
Certainly not the Americans who can afford to drive to rivers and raft and don't think of themselves as among the wealthiest people that have ever lived and the huge imprint they make on the planet.

Time to go start the dishwasher.
 
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