Sounds like you hit the nail on the head - psychopath. Glad you made out OK, could probably have gotten much worse.
Woohoo what's up man!!!I was on this trip and was witness to all of this, I was the one who told him "you are not welcome in this camp". I had my wife and 10yo son on this trip... dude was a mess!!! Never really heard what happened after the trip. I was just glad to be away from all of that...
On a happier note I'm super stoked to run the grand again this year with my favorite folks and boating crew...
On a side note @Rightoarleft is one of the most easy going folks I've ever boated with, truly a genuine good person!
Edit: Thought about this a little more. I’ve told my kids a thousand times, before you judge someone put your feet in their shoes. Sorry to have doubted you. I wasn’t there and clearly didn’t have grasp of the situation. It’s good it’s over and nothing permanent resulted.It was a surreal experience watching this man transform the minds of a group into a servitude of fear. A couple of us could see it happening but by the time we really caught on, it was too late. His calculated lies and manipulation had taken hold and few dared speak against him. I spoke out. He then began to instill a belief that I was an enemy of the group. It worked. And that's when I began to be afraid. I've never witnessed a man exercise such power over minds. These were hard-core backcountry recreationalists. Longtime rafters, climbers and canyoneers. These are not weak people. Nor is he a large man.
Trust me, I know how stupid this sounds. Nobody can be prepared for such a test. I don't think it counts as a learning experience because I'm not sure what actually happened. Seemed almost supernatural at times. The group doesn't talk about it.
Had one Helfrich group pull out of the eddy at Boundary and the Tight Lines (A. Helfrich) group launching the next day pulled right in front of all the privates stacked up in the parking/unloading area at Boundary and dropped their sweep boat right in the middle of the ramp. Their lead guide huffed from under her mask that all us privates should have already launched....but their cousins had only just vacated the eddy that they were busy filling for the next day!! At least a couple of their junior guides approached us and quietly apologized, and one of them helped lower private boats down the ramp to clear the traffic jam.@[email protected] - Helfrich is probably the outfitter I have had the most difficulty with. They are excellent oarsmen and the Middle Fork's oldest guide company. They have a reputation with folks like me that have been lucky enough to run the MF 35+ times. Their boating skills are never in question and I would not question their dedication to their customers and their craft, they are notorious for looking down on the private groups.
Be the calm capable person in an emergency situation and they'll figure it out soon enough!Those with leadership skills, and decades of experience should be careful that they only lead those that are interested in being led.
Unless it's your permit you're just another guy with a boat. Most people are not interested in hearing your raft God resume.
A correct and easy attitude to have. I did notice outfitters to be exceptionally unfriendly on MFS. One spread out 3 oar rigs sideways on the beach at the mouth of a creek we planned to fish. They were doing a full kitchen setup for lunch. Plenty of room for 8+ boats tied correctly. We got shrugs and blank stares first as we tried to row/ drag up the creek past them. Big eye rolls when we politely asked them to make space. They became more hostile as we got closer to the group so we left to avoid conflict. Other examples like this through the week.In the end...I am on the river and I refuse to let a rude person (guide, private, ranger, customer, etc.) spoil it.
Well said.LJPurvis said:In the end...I am on the river and I refuse to let a rude person (guide, private, ranger, customer, etc.) spoil it.
Amen to that, too.Nanko said:There are private a-holes and guide a-holes. I truly can’t understand why. One is getting paid to float, and the other is on the vacation of a lifetime. But if someone’s behavior is as egregious as my examples, it’s intentional for sure. Confronting it is guaranteed to backfire.
Probably you don't. Just saying.Yep MT4Runner!
I always try to remember this: anyone who can be an a-hole even on a river trip must be a profoundly miserable bastard. That is it’s own punishment.
Or maybe just a psychopath like rightoarleft’s story. Craziest river tale I’ve ever come across; I’d love to hear more.
Yeah I'm regretting bringing it up. It put a dark cloud over my day. Maybe sometime I'll share about the time my buddy and I decided to jump on a highwater Middle Owyhee. It's a three day trip. Took us seven. Mistakes were made, boats were had, and an amazing encounter with a group of paddlers from Latvia who turned out to be some of the most decent human beings I've ever met. We were way outclassed, but that's where adventure begins!Craziest river tale I’ve ever come across; I’d love to hear more.