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Discussion Starter #1
I feel the buzzards are a very conscientious group of passionate people that enjoy their interests.

Reading about permit exchange and users vying for the one opportunity brought this up for me.

I was going to express my opinion but changed my mind because it sounded like preaching. Not my place....and after I thought about it I came to the conclusion that I do things against rules when I feel like it.

One thing I follow is that I do not allow compensation from my friends, or their friends, when I take them boating. Personally, I feel it is a detriment to the commercial groups that pay fees, insurance, and other related business expense to offer a taste of what we consider a wonderful experience to others that do not have the same commitment that we do. I feel, these groups do a lot to add to my world in the way of stewardship, care for the environment, support training that I am able to get, et al.

The rules that are in place to help commercials through limiting competition are something I personally do not mess with.

I would like to hear some other views...

True Integrity: what a person would do if they knew they would never get caught....
 

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my compensation when i take friends rafting is they get groover duty.... everyday

besides that i just enjoy having my friends on the river with me and would never want any type of financial compensation for it
 

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Beer, weed, gas money, integrity and morality are all synonymous to the slavetothestrapon. Need to get a gauge on how many cubic feet per second that spews out of his multiple orifices. At least we'd get a read on the water quality while he's on the river next week.
 

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Beer, weed, gas money, integrity and morality are all synonymous to the slavetothestrapon. Need to get a gauge on how many cubic feet per second that spews out of his multiple orifices. At least we'd get a read on the water quality while he's on the river next week.
My first interweb stalker.

I'm touched beyond words.

Best part is you're too dumb to realize that your post is as complimentary as it is derogatory.

Get a life, shit stain.
 

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Discussion Starter #6
a lot of people dance the fence....some say that compensation for gear use is justified....wear and tear on equipment including PFD'

a point made has struck home for me as one of my annual groups work at a major liquor distributor here...perhaps I justify my own actions as a barter situation....wow, my head hurts...
 

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scooby:

I agree with you and admire your position; It's awesome to hear of other people like my friends.

As a person who's been fortunate to have good friends with river gear in the last few years that have been generous enough take me with or loan me their personal gear for trips, I've always tried to pay it forward with...as Slave says, "Beer, Gas money or Food" and honest gratitude.

That said, now that I'm trying to build my own set of river gear and know the full value of this equipment for multi-day river trips, I would never demand that my non-equipped friends pay up for using my boat and equipment, but they can help pay for consumables. For example, we're planning a trip in June and we'll probably plan to split up fees such as gas, permits, food, TP, etc, among everyone in the float party. If someone wants to fish or rent an IK setup, that'll be their own payment option outside of the group fees.

I'm sure my friends who don't float are not aware of the costs associated with owning a boat, frame, oars, coolers, dry box/bags, etc. and I woudn't expect someone to compensate me for use of my gear, but if anyone offers to buy gas, food, etc because of the same position that I experienced when I didn't own gear, then I'm all in.

A form of compensation that is organized is that I have a share with a group of guys that own a drift boat. Between them and I, we trade 1:1 my softside and fishing setup for their hardside drifty. It works out pretty well since we all pretty much fish togeather, however any repairs are up to the owners of the craft. My setup works well for low water or rocky fisheries and their setup works good for deep water such as the N. Platte or the Bighorn.

-scott
 

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My first interweb stalker.

I'm touched beyond words.

Best part is you're too dumb to realize that your post is as complimentary as it is derogatory.

Get a life, shit stain.[/

I just hope to god that you haven't harmed too many smaller animals or sport fish.
Depends on your definitions of smaller and too many.

But don't despair, I only shoot the tasty ones and and they never feel a thing.

Remember that the next time you're walking out of Hole Foods with a couple of overpriced steaks.
 

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I didn't even know this was an issue, I would never ask for compensation. The cost of a trip should be split between everyone (it depends on the group if beer and other intoxicants are a part of the trip costs). Even day trips on the animas I ask everyone to pitch in for gas and beer and of course I make them work etc. No one gets a free ride, but I don't benefit in way excpet for spending time with great people having great fun. I do think its wrong to ask for any sort of compensation outside of this, though I wouldn't mind if a buddy picked up an extra 30 pack because he/she was feeling friendly. P.S. Those animals sure do look tasty slave
 

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yeah, i don't take straight cash from friends and family that come on my trips, for sure. however,on bigger ,multi-day trips with them, i don't feel guilty one bit though if they want to pitch in for my gas, bush flight's share, dinners,shuttle costs,lodging,ect. i spend allot of time planning/logistics, getting difficult permits, rowing them on $6k+ worth of rafting gear they didn't pay for, rowing through rapids they often don't have the skills to run themselves, often having to drive long distances with my raft when they can just fly in and be picked up by me at the airport,the inevitable extra work that goes with it being your rig: before the trip,on the river and after the trip,ect. all they usually have to do is show up and have fun. it seems balanced and fair to me, honestly though goes against the law of the land on permitted rivers.

i'm by no means an ass about it but if someone can't even out the load abit and show some appreciation for the work i do to make the trip happen then it may be awhile before they get their next invite.
 

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Discussion Starter #13
I agree with posters about sharing costs for trips. I am speaking of taking people on a day run. Sometimes friends invite their friends and they often feel obligated to offer/give cash when they see the commercials running. I do not take it. I've read on here and heard some boaters say that getting compensated for the depreciation of gear is acceptable. That's cool, I just don't feel right about it. I have a set of paddles and PFD's for enough people to paddle raft for day trips. I like the group runs. I do it for myself as much as for others. On the day runs I do share fuel expenses. I buy the lunch because I like to entertain but I accept sharing of anything offered that I like...even Early Times which, on one trip turned me into a pirate....Argh!
 

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Discussion Starter #14
Additionally, I always promote the commercial guys. They offer a great trip, always are helpful on the river, and as stated previously do so much for the rivers and the sport....
 

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Here's a question for you guys - Have you ever had a stranger offer cash for a raft trip at the put in?

I'd never had that happen until July last summer, when I was approached by a guy at the Stone Bridge put in, rod in hand on the ark offering $50 for a float. He said he wanted to go on a float fishing trip but the commercial trips were "all booked up".

I told him no, mentioned that float fishing trips go for a whole lot more, and left with the sneaking suspicion that this was a sting being put on by AHRA to snag illegal outfitting.

The whole thing was a bit odd.
 

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Cpt. No Scout
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Hey, If it makes my friends happy who am I to say no. Its not like anyone is ever going actually offer me more than the actual ture cost of the float anyway. When I do the math I got an easy $100 a float into gear alone. Whats the difference in taking $20 of gas, $20 in beer, or $20 cash.. NOTHING! Now take $20 in weed is streight up illegal! but anyway, one just makes you "think" your more ethical. Many outfitters work deals as well and trade goods and services other than cash.

Cash, trade, goods, or services its all the same. Cash is just more liquidable..
 

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On a day trip people usually volunteer to pay some money. I'll tell them to donate to the life jacket fund, because that's the piece of gear that they use. They can see that the pfd's I give them are fairly new, not deteriorated.
 

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GoBro
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Beer is not the same. When I go to a friends house for an evening I bring some drinks. Not as an attempt to pay for part of the house, but as a means to provide something that everyone that night can enjoy. Same for boating. Adding to the groups experience is always welcome. We all bring what we can. Money is different, because if you bring beer and have leftovers you are more than welcome to take it home. Money only benefits the recipients after the trip and only the recipients. That's a big difference in my mind. Gas is a cost everyone can share relatively equally, and it's a basic per trip cost, unlike large pieces of gear.
 

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Usually on my raft the deal is I bring the raft and frame or paddles and PFD's and the passengers bring lunch and beer/drinks. No $$ and we all pitch in loading and unloading.
 

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Cpt. No Scout
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What if money is the only thing the poor sole has to contribute to the group experience?? Say everyone else brought beer and food and gas. Nothing is needed. So, to the guy who has cash. Do you really say keep your money and maybe now the guy feels like a "freeloader" and by "donating" to the PFD fund is the way for him to share with the group... and feel part of the team. Beer = money. Money = beer. We all contribute in our own way. Does everyone really need to stop at the store before we hit the river?
 
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