Rock Creek is about halfway, we just iodine that. Very clear.
Deso drinking water
Keeping up the various Deso threads:
I'm invited on a mid-June Deso; TL is thinking of us not carrying all the drinking water we'll need.
Any experience with the springs there (or clear streams)? The Rivermaps book indciates a spring at McPherson and Dripping Springs; also one near "Petes Point" -- which I did not find on their map. The guidebook also mentioned a few streams, but I wouldn't want to count on those being clear, especially in June.
Filtering/treating/boiling seems prudent no matter the source, but it would be great to not have to deal with sediment (TL mentioned "alum method" for that -- I have no experience with that).
What have y'all done on Deso?
I'm invited on a mid-June Deso; TL is thinking of us not carrying all the drinking water we'll need.
Any experience with the springs there (or clear streams)? The Rivermaps book indciates a spring at McPherson and Dripping Springs; also one near "Petes Point" -- which I did not find on their map. The guidebook also mentioned a few streams, but I wouldn't want to count on those being clear, especially in June.
Filtering/treating/boiling seems prudent no matter the source, but it would be great to not have to deal with sediment (TL mentioned "alum method" for that -- I have no experience with that).
What have y'all done on Deso?
1 - 17 of 17 Posts
Rock Creek is the standard and has easy access. Big pools to filter or obtain water in whatever method you prefer. It should be pretty clear unless there is a thunderstorm which is less common in mid-June as the Monsoon has not normally started yet.
We have also used Chandler Creek on RL but it is right after riffle and just above a rapid. Not everyone is interested in stopping all of their boats there. Tends to have great flow though.
Phillip
We have also used Chandler Creek on RL but it is right after riffle and just above a rapid. Not everyone is interested in stopping all of their boats there. Tends to have great flow though.
Phillip
There is A LOT of fracking around Deso, including in the Rock Creek watershed. I know industry claims there is never a problem, but I carry all my water in down there any more.
Could you substantiate your claim somehow? I know fracking is ongoing in that region, that said it has been the principle mechanism for extraction in that region for decades from what I understand. I also thought most of the issue was underground water like wells being polluted by the process.There is A LOT of fracking around Deso, including in the Rock Creek watershed. I know industry claims there is never a problem, but I carry all my water in down there any more.
I want to be concerned but I would like to see some sort of evidence that I need to change my habits in the canyon. Could you point me to an link somewhere that can educate me on the subject? Especially anything related to how it affects surface water.
Thanks.
Phillip
If you can light the side stream on fire, I would avoid it.
The majority of my info comes from tidbits I've gotten from talking or emailing with Herm Hoops, that wonderful wiley curmudgeon of the Uintah Basin, as well as pieces gleaned from guiding out there, but I don't think I saved any of it. Or I saved it in such a way that I can't now find it when I search for it, which is pretty much the same thing...
Not to be too obvious, but spring fed side streams are just groundwater that has come to the surface, so definitely at risk. The wellhead maps I remember show a pretty good concentration of wells in the upper reaches of the Rock Creek drainage. I can't remember off-hand further south, but don't think there were all that many / any in the Chandler Creek drainage. There have been a handful of chemical spills from closer to Ouray and along the White resulting in river-wide foam that smelled of volatile organics, but the Vernal & Price BLM offices have systematically limited both ground water and surface water quality testing, so we can't know for sure what is out there.
There are probably some geologists who can correct me here, but my understanding is that the old drilling (~1930's-70's) was oil that had collected under an anticline of Weber sandstone between Rangely and Vernal, very traditional extraction. There was the boom & bust in the 80's that had some primitive fracking, but the technology wasn't well developed at that time. They were still mostly doing traditional drilling for that waxy crude that needs to be trucked into SLC for refining. It was always a gassy field and not far from the Wasatch Front, so the infrastructure was there to collect gas, but not until the boom in the 00's did extensive fracking of gas wells really take off into a large-volume thing.
It's said in medicine, the dose makes the poison. With how much drilling activity there has been out there recently, and assuming that there is a proportional amount of spillage & seepage, I just don't trust the water any more. Sorry I can't link or attach any of the stories I remember though.
Edit: Not exactly relevant to the above, but I did find this link about the shale oil http://utah-oil.com/#none
Not to be too obvious, but spring fed side streams are just groundwater that has come to the surface, so definitely at risk. The wellhead maps I remember show a pretty good concentration of wells in the upper reaches of the Rock Creek drainage. I can't remember off-hand further south, but don't think there were all that many / any in the Chandler Creek drainage. There have been a handful of chemical spills from closer to Ouray and along the White resulting in river-wide foam that smelled of volatile organics, but the Vernal & Price BLM offices have systematically limited both ground water and surface water quality testing, so we can't know for sure what is out there.
There are probably some geologists who can correct me here, but my understanding is that the old drilling (~1930's-70's) was oil that had collected under an anticline of Weber sandstone between Rangely and Vernal, very traditional extraction. There was the boom & bust in the 80's that had some primitive fracking, but the technology wasn't well developed at that time. They were still mostly doing traditional drilling for that waxy crude that needs to be trucked into SLC for refining. It was always a gassy field and not far from the Wasatch Front, so the infrastructure was there to collect gas, but not until the boom in the 00's did extensive fracking of gas wells really take off into a large-volume thing.
It's said in medicine, the dose makes the poison. With how much drilling activity there has been out there recently, and assuming that there is a proportional amount of spillage & seepage, I just don't trust the water any more. Sorry I can't link or attach any of the stories I remember though.
Edit: Not exactly relevant to the above, but I did find this link about the shale oil http://utah-oil.com/#none
Thanks for the response and will try to research a little more.\
It's said in medicine, the dose makes the poison. With how much drilling activity there has been out there recently, and assuming that there is a proportional amount of spillage & seepage, I just don't trust the water any more. Sorry I can't link or attach any of the stories I remember though.
Edit: Not exactly relevant to the above, but I did find this link about the shale oil Uinta Basin | An Unconventional Future
The scope of fracking is definitely much larger than in the 80s, no doubt there. Its news to me about the Rock Creek sites but I haven't been actively looking. I thought most of the sites were above 9 mile.
Definitely true about the surface water=ground water. I would imagine its naturally filtered a little more than the manmade pumps pulling out of wells back east but that is a naive guess at best. Not sure much of these volatiles are filtered naturally.
In addition, I know some of the sites have leaked and affected surface water in the past, especially in the headwaters of places like Rockhouse. Probably a smart decision to be overly cautious.
Will do some more research and likely consider switching to primarily refilling at Chandler until I know more.
Thanks again.
Phillip
What I wonder if exposure to that water for say a couple of days (assuming you bring SOME water) is an issue. It's not like your living with it 24x7 and cooking, cleaning and washing in it every day for years.Thanks for the response and will try to research a little more.
The scope of fracking is definitely much larger than in the 80s, no doubt there. Its news to me about the Rock Creek sites but I haven't been actively looking. I thought most of the sites were above 9 mile.
Definitely true about the surface water=ground water. I would imagine its naturally filtered a little more than the manmade pumps pulling out of wells back east but that is a naive guess at best. Not sure much of these volatiles are filtered naturally.
In addition, I know some of the sites have leaked and affected surface water in the past, especially in the headwaters of places like Rockhouse. Probably a smart decision to be overly cautious.
Will do some more research and likely consider switching to primarily refilling at Chandler until I know more.
Thanks again.
Phillip
Hard to know without a water sample, which could range from no detectable contaminants to levels high enough for concern. Not all chemicals are the type that require accumulation to have a medical effect. I wouldn't be too worried about high levels of Guar Gum (tracking is the main reason that food additive became so expensive the last ten years) but I am not sure I would want any levels of petroleum byproducts in my water.
Speculation at this point. That said, if I can wait an extra day and pull from a source that may be cleaner....why not? I mean I already choose to pull from side streams instead of the main stem of the Green so I am already discerning between sources.
And when I drink water I do like it to be clean as possible. I really don't think that is an unusual preference. I mean I use a filter on the river and use one for drinking water at home for that very reason. At the same time I am not gonna dehydrate myself if its the only source or stop from eddie swimming in the Green River to cool off.
I may take some samples when I visit in June and October. Being in a college town I might be able to finagle a test or two.
Phillp
Speculation at this point. That said, if I can wait an extra day and pull from a source that may be cleaner....why not? I mean I already choose to pull from side streams instead of the main stem of the Green so I am already discerning between sources.
And when I drink water I do like it to be clean as possible. I really don't think that is an unusual preference. I mean I use a filter on the river and use one for drinking water at home for that very reason. At the same time I am not gonna dehydrate myself if its the only source or stop from eddie swimming in the Green River to cool off.
I may take some samples when I visit in June and October. Being in a college town I might be able to finagle a test or two.
Phillp
I was shown a list of >350 abandoned gas wells that evidently are all leaking hydrogen sulfide both above and below ground, but the BLM won't put together the cojones to force the owners to properly cap and reclaim them.
That said, after spending a little time with Google Earth, it seems like pretty much all the activity is north of Jack Creek, so I guess I mis-remembered my side canyons.
I still figure I'm not backpacking, and I would rather haul a few extra gallons than risk bad water.
That said, after spending a little time with Google Earth, it seems like pretty much all the activity is north of Jack Creek, so I guess I mis-remembered my side canyons.
I still figure I'm not backpacking, and I would rather haul a few extra gallons than risk bad water.
Thanks for clarifying the location of most. I looked at Google Earth and only saw one or two potential sites near Rock Creek but wasn't sure how old that imagery is. I think I will still just use it as a source then.I was shown a list of >350 abandoned gas wells that evidently are all leaking hydrogen sulfide both above and below ground, but the BLM won't put together the cojones to force the owners to properly cap and reclaim them.
That said, after spending a little time with Google Earth, it seems like pretty much all the activity is north of Jack Creek, so I guess I mis-remembered my side canyons.
I still figure I'm not backpacking, and I would rather haul a few extra gallons than risk bad water.
Phillip
We've found Rock Creek to be good, clean water (boil/sterilize, etc.) and usually refill some of our jugs for dishwater at least. When we once got water from the Macpherson Ranch spring/pipe it left a nasty alkaline ring around the pots and we were less excited.
Where is the pipe\spring at the McPherson ranch?
We always bring our drinking water. Nothing tastes like the home filtered water. We use the side streams and bleach the water and mark the jugs for dishes only. We use rock creek it is the easiest and also chandler creek. It's a quick and pleasant walk from the beach. I think it's easier than settling water.
We always bring our drinking water. Nothing tastes like the home filtered water. We use the side streams and bleach the water and mark the jugs for dishes only. We use rock creek it is the easiest and also chandler creek. It's a quick and pleasant walk from the beach. I think it's easier than settling water.
Just sayin' "thanks" for the info.
It's been too many years since we were there, but if you head off in the bushes downstream of the old motel building you'll encounter wet ground and uphill of that there was a pipe.
1 - 17 of 17 Posts
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