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Discussion Starter #1
Hey everyone. This is my first post here at the Buzz and I look forward to acquainting and learning from everyone.

I am a raft guide and have been for a few years now. I've been on the water my entire life though and love it. Whether it's fishing, swimming, kayaking, or rafting i just love the water. Since I'm a raft guide I have access to boats but i think that it's time for me to get my own. I will be using this boat for up to class IV and maybe an occasional V day trips. As well as light multi-day on my own and maybe an over-nighter here and there with my girlfriend. I will be doing lots of south east stuff and lots of rivers in Montana.

A really great deal popped up with a complete cat set up with frame, oars, trailer, everything. The cat is 13 feet long, I originally had my sites set on a 14 footer but this deal is good enough for me to reconsider.

I don't have a lot of experience with cats but they seem like they would be right up my alley as far as how I've heard they handle and how my paddling style is. I am just concerned about the size.

Do you out there with more experience think that this would be a suitable boat for me? Or at least a good compromise given the awesome deal?

Thanks everyone! I really look forward to becoming part of the community.
 

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After paddling rafts for the last few years I recently bought a cat. Here is my perspective..

Cats are a LOT more forgiving than rafts. Having less rubber in the water makes them nimble and easy to row. Pushy water is less pushy, you have a little more time to make moves because of this. I'm also constantly impressed with the stability of the cat.

13' sounds like a good size for the things that you list. You will not have a lot of room on a multiday with a 13, but certainly enough gear room for a 2 person self support. We saw a 13 foot NRS cat this weekend on the Deschutes that was the lone gear boat for a group of 6 (one on cat and 5 kayakers), but I don't recommend loading any boat like they had it loaded (wish I had gotten pictures).
 

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After paddling rafts for the last few years I recently bought a cat. Here is my perspective..

Cats are a LOT more forgiving than rafts. Having less rubber in the water makes them nimble and easy to row. Pushy water is less pushy, you have a little more time to make moves because of this. I'm also constantly impressed with the stability of the cat.

13' sounds like a good size for the things that you list. You will not have a lot of room on a multiday with a 13, but certainly enough gear room for a 2 person self support. We saw a 13 foot NRS cat this weekend on the Deschutes that was the lone gear boat for a group of 6 (one on cat and 5 kayakers), but I don't recommend loading any boat like they had it loaded (wish I had gotten pictures).
There is no such thing as a 13 foot NRS cat. They start with 14 foot and very fat tubes.
 

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NRS Revolution Cat is 13 X 23. I don't think they make these anymore, but they do exist.

I've been running a 14 ft. cataraft (JPW & Maravia) for about 16 years now. Nice size, and ok for two people on day runs. Overnighters will probably be fine on a 13 or 14 ft. cat. Multi-day trips might get a bit tight, but are doable with planning. What size are the tubes on the 13 ft. raft? 24 inch diameter and bigger would be better for multi-day gear carrying. Cats are fun, but become not as fun if overloaded. Have you given any thought to a raft? A raft would allow for R2- R4 or more for day runs, and more gear carrying capacity for multi-days. Just a thought, since you are in southeast, the land of paddle rafting
 

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Oh yeah...forgot all about the ill-concieved Revolution series they had for a year. DON'T get one of those.

A 13' cat with 22" tubes is just enough for 2 peeps with backpacking gear, for an overnighter, but it'll be fun and sporty for day trips. For anything more than an overnighter you'll want a 24' cat, or a raft.
 

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The rocker of the cat tubes also is a big factor of how much gear you can load on it. My brother has a 13' Momentum tubes that have a long flat footprint and holds quite a bit of gear because it can be spread out across the tubes. Tubes with more rocker limit what you can haul because the weight distribution is more temperamental.
 

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Discussion Starter #8
Thanks for all the replies everyone. I had no preference as to cat vs. raft. I know my way around a raft and they are more plentiful but they are more expensive and i'd get to try something new with the cat. This cat in particular is an awesome deal.
 

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I used to have a Cat, a 14' SB and a 16' SB. I sold the Cat and 14' to simplify my life, not because I didn't like them.

Cat- More forgiving, more stable than the rafts. Far quicker to ferry than a raft. Because of the size/shape of the frame I built some nice big decks that worked great for hauling big/bulky gear. That was great, but, when a Cat gets overloaded, they become slugs. Consequently, it was best for bulky but light gear. A friend claimed his cat was bothered more by wind than a raft would be. I couldn't say because ALL wind bothers me immensely. The Cat seemed to cut thru the top portion of a wave rather than riding over the wave like a raft. That was a wetter ride for sure, maybe more fun though? On the other hand, the Cat made a definitely smoother ride thru wave trains, so maybe not as fun from that standpoint? With it's stability, the Cat was the one I wanted to drive on unfamiliar rivers. I miss my Cat, but like my simplified life without it. For me, a 16' SB is my ideal rig, if I am limited to one boat.
Peace-
 

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Discussion Starter #11
Thanks again for the replies. So far one person has commented on size what do others think of a 13 foot cat for the purposes i listed in my first post?

Thanks.
 

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An Aire Wildcat with 13 X 20 tubes will be a great, fun day tripper. Ok overnighter going backpacker style. Not so good as a multi-day boat. The 13 ft. length isn't the main problem. It's the 20 inch tubes that are going to make it hard to carry two people and a multi-day gear load. If you are mostly going to do day trips then go for it, but if many multi-day trips are in your future, you might want at least a 14 X 22-24 cat.
 

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If it is a screaming deal go for it. But as a screaming deal it may be an older flat top
Style boat. Plenty of people had tons of fun on all rivers for years on those cats. But the newer style boats with more upswept tubes are much more high performance. From what I've heard of old style wildcats is that they may not be a good choice for multidays. Sotar and aire are making awesome cats right now, imo sotar is ahead of aire in design, but both are following similar principles. You aren't going to find killer deals on those. You'll love a cat, get one!
 

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Oh yeah...forgot all about the ill-concieved Revolution series they had for a year. DON'T get one of those.

The 14' Revo raft I bought new for $1700 was the best purchase I ever made in my life, literally. Makes my 14' Hyside feel like a mack truck in comparison (both on the river and off). Very impressed with the material (and everyone that gets a chance to row it too). The post with the person ripping the floor was IMO just "one of those things". I actually have been hoping to see a set of those revo tubes for sale at a good price cuz I'd pick 'em up in a heartbeat.

So, 2 posts and 2 feet in your mouth....impressive

For the OP, if it's that good of a deal I say go with it but multdays will be tight. It is surprising how little stuff my uncle's Aire Jaguarundi (16ft?) holds when compared to my 14 foot rafts. Also IMO a 13' cat is the bare minimum for a 2-up ride.
 

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The 14' Revo raft I bought new for $1700 was the best purchase I ever made in my life, literally. (snip) Very impressed with the material (and everyone that gets a chance to row it too). The post with the person ripping the floor was IMO just "one of those things".
I'll type slowly, and perhaps you can keep up.
NRS sold those boats for ONE season. IF the manufacturer was impressed with the material, they wouldn't have discontinued it in it's first year and reduced the warranty to ONE year.
I could go on about Hyside, Aire and countless others still being on the river a quarter century and more, but if you don't already understand durability...
I won't hold you to the benchmark of 30 years, but come back telling us how impressed you are with the material in 3.

I stand by my opinion, and apparently so does NRS. They're not going to speng $ on material R&D just to scrap quality product in one year.
 

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I'll type slowly, and perhaps you can keep up.
NRS sold those boats for ONE season. IF the manufacturer was impressed with the material, they wouldn't have discontinued it in it's first year and reduced the warranty to ONE year.
I could go on about Hyside, Aire and countless others still being on the river a quarter century and more, but if you don't already understand durability...
I won't hold you to the benchmark of 30 years, but come back telling us how impressed you are with the material in 3.

I stand by my opinion, and apparently so does NRS. They're not going to speng $ on material R&D just to scrap quality product in one year.
I read into "the material costs were higher than anticipated so they discontinued the product" to mean the REPLACEMENT or REPAIR material costs

If the boats were all that and a bag of chips they would have kept the warrantee and raised the price

Instead they drop the warrantee along with the price. What is one to infer?
 

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YMMV...

Not to rehash the Revolution fabric topic, but I have one and it has been all over the place. I've run the Upper Clackamas at 700 cfs with rocks scraping everywhere. I've bombed the hole at Carter Falls, I launched over the side of a bridge on the North Santiam by the D rings, slid over volcanic rocks on the Deschutes - and that material hasn't even lost its shine yet. 60+ river days in two years between my lady and I.

The only downside is that it is hard to roll, the material is holding up very well. I spoke with NRS directly about the boat as I bought mine the day before they went on clearance and I wanted some money back (which NRS sent me) - and they confirmed that they discontinued the boat due to material costs.
 

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I had a 13'x19" Sotar for one season. Awesome boat- for single rower and a light load. Put another person on there and the handling went down substantially. I sold it for near what it had cost new, and moved up to a 14'x23" Sotar. Same design- night and day performance with a load. Even at 14'x23", it's not a two person multi day boat. Light load on an overnight is fine, but pay close attention to your needs and the length AND diameter of a cat. Their performance changes much more quickly with additional load than a raft. Light, maneuverable and highly capable when properly loaded turns into a sluggish submarine when overloaded.
 

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14' raft or small 16' cat for two person multiday.
12-13' raft or 12-14' cat for two person daytrip/backpacker overnighter, or one person multiday.

Get it and get your GF her own cat for the multidays. :)
 

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JPW daddy cat is 13.5 but it is blunt nosed, the water line is still 10 ft. The royal flush is about 14.5 with a water line of 106 inches, and both are big enough to carry your share of gear down the grand. We have many culebra Frameless cataraft models The larger ones have 22 in diameter tubes. Then there are our self bailing raft options. This price list is for 2014, so for now they are a bit less. Thank you for asking, and for allowing us to put our prices and our web pages out infront of everyone. I will take questions at [email protected] if anyone is interested.
 
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