New Cataraft questions. - Page 2 - Mountain Buzz
 



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Old 12-17-2018   #11
 
yesimapirate's Avatar
 
Up shites creek, Colorado
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My suggestion would be to not have your big ticket items hanging lower than the lowest rails. I would think that ups the risk a fair amount of busting a cooler or dry box on a rock.

My other suggestion is go with the new bigger Navigator from Canyon Cooler. It's your $. I'm just spending it!

https://www.mountainbuzz.com/forums/...tml#post714743

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Old 12-17-2018   #12
 
santa fe, New Mexico
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Join Date: May 2018
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I run a 14' cat of similar width, gear above lower rails, and have hit the lower rails hard on rocks in low water conditions more than once, it is an uncomfortable experience, I would not want gear hanging below the rails for sure, the dynamic impact would not be kind to your brand new and expensive navigator 150
and [email protected] why would you not bring your cat on the salt (I have never been but was considering it this spring if it is running)?
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Old 12-17-2018   #13
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Tabernash, Colorado
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I feel the same way about hanging stuff bellow my side rails, as Yesiamapirate, and trueBlue said. Risky to have things hang bellow them.
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Old 12-17-2018   #14
 
Join Date: Sep 2018
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Thanks for your words guys. It’s definetly a concern to me to have things “vulnerable” I’m naturally hard on my things. It’s there to be used. Then fixed when I break it. Dryboxes I can repair, coolers not so much. This would shrink my wodth by a few inches having the cooler kiss the tubes. The 150 would be sweet! It would also get my OA width to almost 92” with it kissing the tubes. This is my first boat, and I’m on budget the 103qt will do just fine. Once I get 16 ft tubes I’ll entertain that.

Do any of you have photos of your cats? I’d like to see what you’re cooler/ drybox setups look like.

Assuming I set the cooler on top of the rails. With a 10” drop that gives 8” of stick up above the upper tubes. My knee to foot is somewhere in the 18”range. I don’t have a tape handy. This takes away the nice feature of the lip in the canyon cooler to rest on the frame. But seems like a reasonable height to sit on. What coolers are you guys running? Any other manufacturers put a drain in the long side of a cooler?
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Old 12-19-2018   #15
 
Colorado Springs, Colorado
Paddling Since: 2016
Join Date: Jul 2017
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Cat frame

From all the frames I've built, and all the inherent disappointments I've hadmy suggestions
Build with 1 5/8" anodized thick walled aluminum pipe, and build your cat to standard NRS sizes, then when you want to modify or change the frame up you can buy new parts, or modify existing that drop right in. The dimensions would be valid whether you weld, or use speedrail fittings, or NRS fittings.
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Old 12-19-2018   #16
 
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Kalispell, Montana
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OP, what material do you plan to use to build your frame?Some laugh, but I use 1.25" thinwall EMT conduit, which is 1.6" OD and a very close fit with NRS lopro fittings. It's surprisingly robust. I have a stern frame, a 2-bay day frame, and a big 4-bay frame that I can also attach drop tubes to run as a cat frame.



Look to commercial frames for details:


Madcatr seems to have cat frames dialed for clearance as well as footrest/scout bar design..oh, and folding oar towers (NRS towers would offer the same flexibility)

Quote:
Originally Posted by Priceless View Post
From all the frames I've built, and all the inherent disappointments I've hadmy suggestions
Build with 1 5/8" anodized thick walled aluminum pipe, and build your cat to standard NRS sizes, then when you want to modify or change the frame up you can buy new parts, or modify existing that drop right in. The dimensions would be valid whether you weld, or use speedrail fittings, or NRS fittings.
This is VERY good advice. Even if you weld some parts, being able to move your oar towers or your cooler or seat crosstubes is invaluable.
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Old 12-19-2018   #17
 
Join Date: Sep 2018
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I will be using 1 1/4 pipe. I work at a ski resort. We (not me personally) did a big snowmaking project this past summer, and had a ton of snow guns replaced. It was going to scrap for beer money so I opted to buy some beer! I got about 125? Ish feet. All usable material, one mans trash.. I will have a welded outer loop. Double rail with diamond plate. Then my bay cross bars will all be adjustable. 3 bay main frame. Then 2 bay passenger module with later drop bag/ table module. I’m trying to figure out if I can make my drop bars with t fittings and have adjustable spreaders. Haven’t laid that out yet. Anyone have thoughts? Maybe more of a NRS universals drop bar then have different length spreaders? Still not sure just yet..
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Old 12-20-2018   #18
 
Billings, Montana
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Join Date: Jun 2012
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Zboy, good luck with the frame. I donít know if you thought about your oars, but you have to match the top frame width with the length of oars you are going to use. Normally 6 feet between the oarlocks uses 10 foot oars. I agree with the others, try to make your frame close to standard sizes. Another thing you might want to consider is a floor. For a gear cat, I have been using a floor all the time. It is made of trampoline fabric, and you might want to consider the sizes of standard floors, although you can get one custom made. It is smart to make it as adjustable as you can. The set up you start with may not be the one you like long term.

Bighorn, help me understand what you are doing. I run a 16 ft Aire Jag, and I donít like to load it up with more than 1200 lbs. I thought maybe there is something different about Sotar, so I went to their website, and they donít even make a 16 foot cat. It shows as 15í 6Ē. Did they previously make one? Also it shows that at 1/3 submergence, weight carried is 1100 lbs. Your picture and the space you say the bottom rails are above the water would be pretty close to 1/3 submergence, so I am not sure if you are really carrying a full ton.

Your picture shows your boat nose high and stern low. Do you like to run that way? I like to run balanced. The boat turns better, and it punches features better. It looks like you have plenty of wear strip up front and you could slide the frame forward and get balanced. I know everyone has their own preference on these things, but I am curious.
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Old 12-20-2018   #19
 
Ridgway, Colorado
Join Date: Mar 2009
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Couple thoughts.
I really like having my passengers behind me and the gear pile in front. Makes reading water way easier.
I'm pretty anal about the trim; the heavier end wants to lead. If i've got some fat asses sitting on the cooler in back, I'll figure out a way to get more weight up front.
Erectorset frames (NRS, RowFrame) are an awesome way to figure out what works for you. We're all pretty opinionated around here. What works for me may suck for the next guy. Keep it cheap and versitle until find yer groove, all those fittings will come back into play when you get your sport cat
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Old 12-21-2018   #20
 
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lafayette or Grand Lake, CO., Colorado
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Quote:
Originally Posted by KrisG View Post
Zboy

Bighorn, help me understand what you are doing. I run a 16 ft Aire Jag, and I don’t like to load it up with more than 1200 lbs. I thought maybe there is something different about Sotar, so I went to their website, and they don’t even make a 16 foot cat. It shows as 15’ 6”. Did they previously make one? Also it shows that at 1/3 submergence, weight carried is 1100 lbs. Your picture and the space you say the bottom rails are above the water would be pretty close to 1/3 submergence, so I am not sure if you are really carrying a full ton.

Your picture shows your boat nose high and stern low. Do you like to run that way? I like to run balanced. The boat turns better, and it punches features better. It looks like you have plenty of wear strip up front and you could slide the frame forward and get balanced. I know everyone has their own preference on these things, but I am curious.

The picture I posted is with about 12-1300#'s. On a short easy row (deso and gray I believe). I do not get real concerned about being level and adjust the load as I go if. I prefer level on most rivers and a little nose heavy in rapids with big holes.


Sotar makes custom sizes (or at least they did when I ordered mine) and I ordered mine at 16' and closer to 25" diam. The only time I run really heavy is on the grand or if I have 4 passengers and all the gear.


I also have a full length web floor 11' 4" long


Below is a copy on my e-mail to Sotar and their response about weight.
I e-mailed them after having a argument with a ranger on the green about how many passengers I could carry.





-----Original Message-----
From: scott brunk [mailto:[email protected]]
Sent: Friday, February 15, 2008 3:14 PM
To: Cheryl
Subject: capacity of boat






I have permits for Green river Desolation canyon, Gates of Lodore and Hells canyon on the snake for 2008 .
I bought a 16 foot Cat from you all and would be very grateful if you could e-mail me the number of people and weight it is rated to carry, so I can have info to show the ranger and hopefully avoid problems.

Scott Brunk
1478 High Plains Court
Lafayette, CO 80026


Cheryl Sanders <[email protected]>


Fri 2/15/2008, 5:41 PM


You


Hi Scott,


Lucky Lucky You!


You have a 16’ x 25" diameter ST cat. Our recommended carrying capacity for the best performance is with 1/3 of the tube in the water @ 1700 lbs.


If you were to go with 10" of tube in the water which is still OK, you can carry as much as 2300 lbs. As far as people go it depends on how you set your frame up. Normally on a cat this size it would be 4 or 5 people depending on gear and seating.


Let me know if you need anything else.


If you get any pictures, forward a couple to us so we can daydream while we’re sitting here in the office.


Have a great summer.


Cheryl








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