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Old 01-16-2015   #1
 
trickpony's Avatar
 
Canon City, Colorado
Paddling Since: 2008
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Posts: 69
A quiver of one...

Okay - so I finally decided that I'm going to keep my narrow(ish) 13.5' Hyside and use it as a paddle boat and oar boat. I've seen some people that really do a good job loading these puppies down... I'd love to see your ideas for getting maximum, clean loading out of a smaller boat.

I'm not so much worried about soft gear - but I'd love to hear about ingenious ideas (and pictures? eh?) for:
1) Plywood floors (and attachment points? particularly if the bailing floor is not laced in...?)
2) Propane tanks
3) Rigging Ammo cans on either side of the rower's feet
4) Beer, beer, and most importantly... er... uh... beer...

Thanks!!

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Old 01-18-2015   #2
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FtC / Rancho del Rio, Colorado
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with a 13.5footer, a single sheet of plywood should be long enough to make a floor that stretches from one end of your frame to the opposite end of the boat. a one piece floor/beaver tail all in one.
my buddy's 14ft avon is a touch long for this, but not much, so it still works great.
when we were routing out the holes for hanging it from the frame, we also measured and routed some extra holes to strap in a rocketbox on each side of your feet in the cockpit.
i like the rigidity from a single piece of wood. with a separate hanging beavertail you don't have as stable of a platform for a passenger to stand on. and without passengers you can have the beavertail on either end you want for strapping harder gear.
...just make sure you suspend any floor with a couple inches clearance off the rubber floor...

if you happen to have a double rail frame.. i saw a guy drill holes in the side decking to secure a milk crate on each side(in front of the towers looks like it works best). there's a size of milk crate that fits a propane bomb perfectly. kinda odd looking, but the 1 time i saw it, it worked awesome. saves a ton of space.

as far as beer. keep the beers for later in the trip in your un-used groover boxes(if your on that long of a trip!). when you need the next groover, wash them beers off and enjoy!! a 30mil rocketbox fits a 30pack and an 18pack in their boxes, with a little room for loosies..
gross, but effective..

or just drag-bag a bunch of em!!
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Old 01-18-2015   #3
 
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Canon City, Colorado
Paddling Since: 2008
Join Date: Apr 2010
Posts: 69
Bigben - thanks for the idea! I really like the thought of having a single piece of plywood... but how did you guys suspend it? Just hang straps on the frame? Glue in intermediate d-rings? Both?

Quote:
Originally Posted by bigben View Post
with a 13.5footer, a single sheet of plywood should be long enough to make a floor that stretches from one end of your frame to the opposite end of the boat. a one piece floor/beaver tail all in one.
my buddy's 14ft avon is a touch long for this, but not much, so it still works great.
when we were routing out the holes for hanging it from the frame, we also measured and routed some extra holes to strap in a rocketbox on each side of your feet in the cockpit.
i like the rigidity from a single piece of wood. with a separate hanging beavertail you don't have as stable of a platform for a passenger to stand on. and without passengers you can have the beavertail on either end you want for strapping harder gear.
...just make sure you suspend any floor with a couple inches clearance off the rubber floor...

if you happen to have a double rail frame.. i saw a guy drill holes in the side decking to secure a milk crate on each side(in front of the towers looks like it works best). there's a size of milk crate that fits a propane bomb perfectly. kinda odd looking, but the 1 time i saw it, it worked awesome. saves a ton of space.

as far as beer. keep the beers for later in the trip in your un-used groover boxes(if your on that long of a trip!). when you need the next groover, wash them beers off and enjoy!! a 30mil rocketbox fits a 30pack and an 18pack in their boxes, with a little room for loosies..
gross, but effective..

or just drag-bag a bunch of em!!
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Old 01-19-2015   #4
 
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Boulder, Colorado
Paddling Since: 2000
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I just hang my floor. It works pretty well. If the floor extends under the cooler and/or dry boxes it can't really move much. If you're going for durability and a long floor you might want to re-enforce it with additional wood or metal. Or go big and get a aluminum floor from a frame welding shop. They are expensive but maintenance free and very long lasting. I also cam my rocket boxes to the floor.

I run a pacific river bag (aka "everything bag) in my rear cargo hold - it makes rigging much faster. On long trips (like the Grand) I also run a cargo net over my front gear pile.

I duct tape my beer in their original boxes. I learned the hard way that throwing loose beers in a bag is a recipe for disaster (or at least destroyed beer cans). Rubbing beer cans equals empty beer cans. A 5 gallon bucket is also a good beer holder, just tear up the box the beer came in and use pieces of the cardboard to stop the cans from rubbing too much. Also make sure all the cans are upright.

I have a 14' boat that's been down the grand, middle fork salmon, cataract, selway, salt and a bunch of other rivers. Small boats and big water equal big fun. If space is tight remember that liquor and powered drink mixes take up less space than beers do. Also sitting on or over a cooler or dry box takes less space than having a dedicated seat.
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Old 01-19-2015   #5
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Salida, Colorado
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We make our Everything Bag in varying sizes... though not specifically for a 13.5'. We do a 14', a simple round and a super puma size... any of which would work in a 13.5' boat. We can always make custom sizes too. An everything Bag really does make rigging a whole new world of Awesome though!

And ditto the duct taping of your beer boxes! Also, it's very true that liquor takes up less space and goes farther for each sip... though I know it's not the same as that cool bubbly barley pop! I find I always end up bringing too much beer & not enough liquor myself...
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Old 01-19-2015   #6
 
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Belgrade, Montana
Paddling Since: 1991
Join Date: Sep 2013
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Quote:
Originally Posted by trickpony View Post
Okay - so I finally decided that I'm going to keep my narrow(ish) 13.5' Hyside and use it as a paddle boat and oar boat. I've seen some people that really do a good job loading these puppies down... I'd love to see your ideas for getting maximum, clean loading out of a smaller boat.

I'm not so much worried about soft gear - but I'd love to hear about ingenious ideas (and pictures? eh?) for:
1) Plywood floors (and attachment points? particularly if the bailing floor is not laced in...?)
2) Propane tanks
3) Rigging Ammo cans on either side of the rower's feet
4) Beer, beer, and most importantly... er... uh... beer...

Thanks!!
my rear floor system - also built for fishing. I just fit a piece of 3/4" ply on top. Very stable and a great place for propane (in center) with boxes of beer placed around it. Then I lay bags on top of the beer, etc.



Here it is with the rear floor and rowers floor. The rear floor just rests on the frame but I could remove the frame and hang it as a beaver tail. The rowers floor has blocks to lower it 2" (just visible right side - so I can stand and row better) but other wise is just strapped to my foot bar and dry box/rowers seat with two long straps looped under the floor. My old floor in my old hyside was attached the same way for a dozen plus years with the same straps and same piece of raw plywood - In fact it's still in use with the new owner.


I've run both beaver tails and cargo floors over the years in all kinds of configurations. but most common was a mesh cargo floor with all our beer in boxes creating a deck that the remaining gear was piled on. You will always loose some soldiers, not matter how you pack beer (maybe not in the groovers, but hey I try to keep my incoming separate from my outgoing...) I really like my new setup with the hard floor and trailer frame - super stiff very solid easy late night cooler access, etc.

BUT - I have thought of doing a full solid floor (at least from the stern to the forward cooler bay, so I could see that being a nice option. Hanging it would be relatively simple just drop a strap (on each side) at each major bay and run it under the ply then to the other side of the bay... When I first set this rig up, I had the rowers floor span both the rowers bay and the cooler by but found it held my cooler too high and was just added weight so I cut it out. You might experiment with cooler/drybox height to determine if you really want plywood under them or not.
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Old 01-19-2015   #7
 
south lake tahoe, California
Paddling Since: 1974
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Posts: 95
Elkhaven,
Is your back seat able to n handle pretty big people with the seat/floor supports not being on the tubes? Great idea, just want to make sure. I've got a couple clients in the 300 range.

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Old 01-19-2015   #8
fat guy in a little boat
 
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FtC / Rancho del Rio, Colorado
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just hang the floor with cam straps. rout out slots in the wood for the straps corresponding to where they're gonna go over the frame and back down to the floor. we tied a knot in the straps so they wouldn't come out during transport. the floorboard stays stored with all the straps still on there.
when it's all loaded up and strapped down it really feels like it's all one piece.

full length beavertail floor extending up front, everything bag in the back!!

so that thing i was talking about with the propane tanks in milk crates mounted to the side decking... it was on Riverrat Ray from Tuffriverstuff's boat. I'll bet they've got some pictures of it. might not work on a smaller boat, but it's an awesome idea..
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Old 01-19-2015   #9
 
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Belgrade, Montana
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Chiapet, the seat does sit on the rear tubes, the stringers are about 40 inches long and they're supported by the rear tube and the rear crossmember. I weigh 250 and have two heavier buddies, no problem on weight. I'm sure it would handle more weight than you'd want sitting on the back tube - ie wheelie, severely out of balance boat!

I like the set up waaaayyyyy better than nrs's system. Easier to get in and out, no kneeling on bars, etc. The hard floor is awesome for my 72 yo dad and one legged mom! Plus my boys and dogs can lay back there and play.
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Old 01-20-2015   #10
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Salida, Colorado
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bigben View Post
just hang the floor with cam straps. rout out slots in the wood for the straps corresponding to where they're gonna go over the frame and back down to the floor. we tied a knot in the straps so they wouldn't come out during transport. the floorboard stays stored with all the straps still on there.
when it's all loaded up and strapped down it really feels like it's all one piece.

full length beavertail floor extending up front, everything bag in the back!!

so that thing i was talking about with the propane tanks in milk crates mounted to the side decking... it was on Riverrat Ray from Tuffriverstuff's boat. I'll bet they've got some pictures of it. might not work on a smaller boat, but it's an awesome idea..
From the mouth of the master himself... This is Rivers Rat Ray's description of how he rigs his boat:



"Mine is a bigger boat (16') but the principles are the same & I had my 14' boat rigged the same way.


1. Propane tanks fit nicely in milk crates, which fit nicely on the
front(s) of double side rails. A little glueing and carving some foam and you have protective covers/seats. I then made PVC covers for those to keep dry butts dry.
It does put some weight higher up than I'd like it but that weight is up front and is mostly gone by Lava & the lower space on my rig is full of rocket boxes and water so it's the only place left. I do not like putting things that heavy in the back, rapidly vanishing beer excepted.


2. I made a floor from 3/4" concrete forming plywood and suspended it from my frame. It's been great and is still flat after almost 20 years.
It's also kept my floor in cherry condition AND provides extra stiffness for those big hits.

3. Straps through the plywood floor hold a rocket box on each side of my cockpit. 30mm boxes preferred.



4. Somehow there's always room for beer. "

PS. I'll try to find some pictures for ya!
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