146DD vs 143D - Mountain Buzz
 



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Old 01-28-2019   #1
 
Whitefish, Montana
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146DD vs 143D

Hmmm...Who's rowed them? Had a 130D, loved it. Had a 156R, too big. Pros, cons, go! Please and thank you.

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Old 01-28-2019   #2
 
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Lakewood, Colorado
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The first batch of 146DD's has only really started to ship in the last week or two...so not many people will have gotten them on the water. Mine gets to me in about a week or so....very much looking forward to it.

The main difference is interior room, but the rocker profiles between the two are very different. The 143D will be a bit more maneuverable and quick due to its continuous rocker profile, but the 146DD will carry more gear and be more stable due its wider flatter profile. The 146DD has a ton more interior room compared to the 143D as well.

You'll probably be happy either way. If you wanted a boat more for day trips and paddle rafting but could do a multi-day trip or two each year...I'd probably go 143D. If you wanted a "do everything" boat primarily geared towards rowing multi-days but that would do great as a paddle raft occasionally too, I'd probably go with the 146DD.

The 146DD is certainly in the sweet spot as a "jack of all trades" boat. I have a 136DD right now, and am looking forward to a slightly longer boat that can fit a bit more gear plus it has slightly more progressive rocker so it should be a bit quicker and more punchy through waves and holes.

Check out this thread for a lot of discussion about the 136DD and 146DD... https://www.mountainbuzz.com/forums/...6dd-96259.html
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Old 01-28-2019   #3
 
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Salt Lake City, Utah
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I've rowed a 143D and I just received my 146DD late last week. I agree with what Electric-Mayhem said. If you're more into multi-day rowing, the 146DD seems better. My first trip out on it will be with my friend who has the 143D, both with sealed floors. It'll be fun to do some direct comparisons then.
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Old 01-29-2019   #4
 
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Kalispell, Montana
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Electric-Mayhem
You'll probably be happy either way. If you wanted a boat more for day trips and paddle rafting but could do a multi-day trip or two each year...I'd probably go 143D. If you wanted a "do everything" boat primarily geared towards rowing multi-days but that would do great as a paddle raft occasionally too, I'd probably go with the 146DD.

The 146DD is certainly in the sweet spot as a "jack of all trades" boat.

I'd also tend to agree. Buddy of mine has the 143D and it's a little sports car. Continuous rocker really makes it nimble, it's a great paddle raft.


I have a Trib 13.0 and it carries a similar volume as the 143D, but has flat rocker under the chafers. My 13' boat is just a tad bit small for a do-everything boat.


I also have the 156R, which is awesome for multidays, but too big for everything else. I don't like to put 8 people drinking beer in it for a day trip, I'd rather have a bit more solitude and take the 13' boat out more.
The 143R would be a great gear hauler, but I agree, less of a paddle raft.

So the 143DD seems like a really awesome all-around boat. DO get the sealed floor. The ballast floor is really my biggest complaint about my Aires. Putting a ballast floor in a nimble boat seems like a huge mistake.
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Old 01-29-2019   #5
 
Whitefish, Montana
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MT4Runner View Post
I'd also tend to agree. Buddy of mine has the 143D and it's a little sports car. Continuous rocker really makes it nimble, it's a great paddle raft.


I have a Trib 13.0 and it carries a similar volume as the 143D, but has flat rocker under the chafers. My 13' boat is just a tad bit small for a do-everything boat.


I also have the 156R, which is awesome for multidays, but too big for everything else. I don't like to put 8 people drinking beer in it for a day trip, I'd rather have a bit more solitude and take the 13' boat out more.
The 143R would be a great gear hauler, but I agree, less of a paddle raft.

So the 143DD seems like a really awesome all-around boat. DO get the sealed floor. The ballast floor is really my biggest complaint about my Aires. Putting a ballast floor in a nimble boat seems like a huge mistake.
Thanks, everyone. I've never considered the sealed floor pocket - how dramatic is the difference between that and the ballast floor? I do like the "traditional" floor - seems to track really well and less likely to flip but would love to hear insights on the merits of both.
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Old 01-29-2019   #6
 
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I went from a 16' Maravia Williwaw 2 to the Aire 156R. Quite similar boat shapes, but the Maravia's dropstitch floor to the Aire's "traditional" ballast floor was a huge difference.

Yes, it tracks well, but if you're on the wrong line, it just keeps tracking.
Yes, it's probably saved me from a flip or two that I may not even realize were imminent...but the flip risk is a part of boating.



I come from a kayaking background, and I want the boat to go where I tell it to go. While I own two ballast floor boats, I'm not a fan.

I don't know what kind of boating you plan to do--what's your plan? Nothing is really going to flip you on the NF Flathead/MF Flathead/Blackfoot, regardless of the boat (OK, boats over 10'). Flips aren't frequent on the Alberton Gorge..more a function of hitting the wrong eddy seam at higher water. A flip could happen on Buffalo on the lower Flathead...but line choice and a good highside make a difference.

On the Lochsa, you may or may not flip..depends more on your line and the mood of the river, and the high-siding skill of your bow riders. Say your odds are 1 in 20 of a flip with a traditional floor boat...maybe it's 1 in 15-18 with the sealed floor. It really doesn't make a vast difference in not flipping, but does make a noticeable difference in maneuverability.
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Old 01-29-2019   #7
 
Whitefish, Montana
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MT4Runner View Post
I went from a 16' Maravia Williwaw 2 to the Aire 156R. Quite similar boat shapes, but the Maravia's dropstitch floor to the Aire's "traditional" ballast floor was a huge difference.

Yes, it tracks well, but if you're on the wrong line, it just keeps tracking.
Yes, it's probably saved me from a flip or two that I may not even realize were imminent...but the flip risk is a part of boating.



I come from a kayaking background, and I want the boat to go where I tell it to go. While I own two ballast floor boats, I'm not a fan.

I don't know what kind of boating you plan to do--what's your plan? Nothing is really going to flip you on the NF Flathead/MF Flathead/Blackfoot, regardless of the boat (OK, boats over 10'). Flips aren't frequent on the Alberton Gorge..more a function of hitting the wrong eddy seam at higher water. A flip could happen on Buffalo on the lower Flathead...but line choice and a good highside make a difference.

On the Lochsa, you may or may not flip..depends more on your line and the mood of the river, and the high-siding skill of your bow riders. Say your odds are 1 in 20 of a flip with a traditional floor boat...maybe it's 1 in 15-18 with the sealed floor. It really doesn't make a vast difference in not flipping, but does make a noticeable difference in maneuverability.
Mostly NF and MF Flathead, some Buffalo/Alberton (occasional Schaefer/MFS/Lower Salmon). Currently running a Maravia Diablo - love it - just a tad too narrow for our family and gear. Looking for the "one that does it all" boat for next few years.
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Old 01-29-2019   #8
 
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If you dig the Diablo, you could just upgrade to a Zephyr. I love my Aire, but realize there are other options for people who make rafts and if you like how Maravia does it then there are options. The 146DD is about in the middle between the Diablo and Zephyr in both length and width. It appears the 146DD has a bit more interior room due to the more aggressively diminished tubes.

As I said in the other thread I linked...I thought the 136DD was the boat that would last me a decade, but the 146DD solved the few issues I had with the the 136DD (more progressive rocker and a bit more room) so unless I truly hate it...I think the 146DD will take its spot. I have a Hyside Mini-Max and Avon Pro as well...so I'm covered if I need a true gear hauler or day trip/small river boat too. I think the Avon might go to a new home if the 146DD works out like I think it will though.

Not gonna lie...I saw a thread about some new urethane material that Wing is making their boats with that is both very stiff but light and durable and was awfully tempted to see what they can do. They are a bit more expensive then Aire and Maravia stuff (another thousand dollars) but they are also legendary for their longevity and durability.
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Old 01-29-2019   #9
 
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I second the Zephyr suggestion. Adding two or three inches of width is not going to do much for you. The Zephyr is a well proportioned boat and they're ain't a whole lot of slots you can fit a Diablo through that won't take the Zephyr too. Just get the Zephyr.

I love my ballast floor Super Puma; its a magical little boat on a steep creek but I can understand how it would be cumbersome in a larger boat. I like all the other 13' AIRE designs too, but besides the 126DD the DD line doesn't do it for me. I don't really see the benefit of stuffing one more drybag down between the tubes in the back when it can just go on top. If you want a boat that can carry gear then get a bigger, normal shaped boat. But if they tickle your fancy then go for it.

Most of the larger AIRE boats, especially the 14ers are far too skinny for my taste. I like 40" between the tubes in a boat that size. Also, I feel like unless you've got a really crack crew, trying to compare the paddling performance difference between such similar boats is going to be hard and since you're probably only out for a splash and giggle who really needs to.

From what I've seen of what I think will be the new Wing 14.5, I'm smitten. If I was shopping for a new boat that size, it would be a top contender.
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Old 02-01-2019   #10
 
Join Date: Feb 2019
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Looking forward to seeing what you end up getting! Hopefully I can get a ride in it as well! I'll row, you can fish.
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