Upper Salt Permit - Mountain Buzz
 



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Old 11-26-2016   #1
 
Apache Junction, Arizona
Paddling Since: 2008
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Upper Salt Permit

Anybody else having problems submitting for the upper salt river permits? It was supposed to go up about a week and half ago but the site keeps telling me it is down every day. Just wanted to make sure it's not my computer crapping out on me.

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Old 12-01-2016   #2
 
Apache Junction, Arizona
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For anyone who cares it looks like you won't be able to submit till January this year. They are moving to recreation.gov website.
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Old 12-01-2016   #3
 
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Buena Vista, Colorado
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While I don't particularly care for the Rec.gov system it is better than the previous procedures of the Apaches. They screwed the lottery up pretty damn good the last couple years...
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Old 12-01-2016   #4
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Tabernash, Colorado
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Quote:
Originally Posted by lmyers View Post
While I don't particularly care for the Rec.gov system it is better than the previous procedures of the Apaches. They screwed the lottery up pretty damn good the last couple years...
You mean the drunken dart throwing part?
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Old 12-01-2016   #5
 
Jenks, Oklahoma
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I am curious to know how the Apaches screwed up the Upper Salt Permit procedures.

Me or my buds scored a bunch of Salt Permits over the years. I do not remember any of them having any thing to do with the Apaches. However some branch of the Federal Government had their fingerprints all over the permits.

I never had any issues with the Apaches, just pay up and off you go. No permit drawings etc.
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Old 12-01-2016   #6
 
Apache Junction, Arizona
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The Apaches are who you pay to go down the first part no drawing except the cash. The Tonto national Forest was in charge of the permit and they used Kinsail which was kind of a weird system.
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Old 12-01-2016   #7
 
cedar city, Utah
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Also curious about the Apache critique. Never succeeded in lottery but I thought it was solely controlled by USFS and Apache permit was separate (mandatory but easy). USFS still controls permit after recreation.gov lottery if I understand the situation correctly.
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Old 12-01-2016   #8
 
Apache Junction, Arizona
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Kinsail a contracted company handled it previously. Now it will be handled like the other rivers through recreation.gov. It will be a different website and a different person doing the drawing. It doesn't change the number being drawn or the amount going.
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Old 12-02-2016   #9
 
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Buena Vista, Colorado
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jdsampsonite View Post
The Apaches are who you pay to go down the first part no drawing except the cash. The Tonto national Forest was in charge of the permit and they used Kinsail which was kind of a weird system.
Kinsail is who I should have criticized, not the Apaches.

The last few years they have issued permits to people for dates they did not request while leaving requested dates open.... amongst other issues.
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Old 12-03-2016   #10
 
Durango, Colorado
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Our trip had serious issue with the Apache permit system last year. We tried to get the Apache permit online before arriving, and were not successful. So we decided to pay at the box at the put in. That was a no go, they removed the box. We were told by a couple commercial guides that the k-Mart in Show low was the only place where the permit in question could be purchased, because the online system does not work most of the time. With this new information in hand we sent a runner while we were rigging boats to secure a permit in Show Low. He returned 3 hours later empty handed, and explained that the printer at the k Mart was not working, and they could not sell any permits. This is when the Apache rangers arrived, and starter contacting people in the parking lot. Since we were fully rigged, had already won and paid for the correct permit from the feds, had already set shuttle and did everything reasonabe to secure the Apache permit, we shoved off before they could come talk to us. It made the trip much more stressful, and I felt at the time that the Apache were making the permits difficult to get to increase fine revenue since the fines are much larger than the cost of the permit. Since they did not contact us, or fine us, I am more inclined to believe the issue is probably incompetence related.

It seems ridiculous to me that the feds will issue a permit, that requires another possibly impossible to obtain permit to use. Why don't they roll the 2 permits together and charge one fee at the time of payment? That would insure that all permit holders have both permits, and also eliminate the confusion caused by having 2 seperate permits required for the same stretch of river.
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