Ruby/Westwater trip cost

[mdt67]

Well i have been doing three night four day Ruby/westwater trips for over twenty years and they come in around 100.00 per person for camping, permit and food costs. My girlfriend and i buy high quality food and do all the prep etc. I bring all the gear including a motor etc.



I brought a newby down and he asked me if i was "smoking crack" when i told him he owed 110.00 for the trip and refused to pay?



Do any of you do this trip any cheaper? Let me know...

[zbaird]

Sounds like you should out his name so that no one boats with him.

Ive done cheaper (before the permit) and way more expensive (including booze, party favors) ruby/westys. That seems pretty reasonable, and these days, on the cheap side for a 4 day trip. Seems nowadays for a permitted run where good food and a good dinner drink is provided,$40-50 a day is the norm. Sometimes this includes trip cost shuttles, sometimes not.

My advice is three fold. 1) Tell dude to pay you what he thinks is reasonable, mentioning permit fees (probably 20-30 a head right?), and extras he might not think about, collect it, and never talk to him again. 2) When I am trip leading I usually try and give people an idea (usually a high guess after talking with anyone bringing items that will be trip cost) of the trip cost. That way there souldn't be any bitching at the end. 3) Dude sounds like the guy in the party at dinner that chips in his exact menu item cost (if that), no tax, no tip, maybe even "forgetting" he ordered a $10 cocktail. I have really tried to rid myself of these people as much as possible. My SO has several friends I will not go out with because I just get pissed. If I do have to go out with them I plan on picking up the bill. The good ones will always venmo me or whatever and the shitbirds, nothing.

[mdt67]

I have a great crew that I regularly go with who are grateful and never question the cost. I tried giving him a breakdown of the cost- 6 people so camping in Ruby is 60 per night x2, westwater permit is 10 per, food is usually 15 to 20 per day and a 35 .00 camp the night before put in. WTF!


Needless to say he wont be going again. I tried to explain this to him and the fact that it costs me far more than that in money and time but seems to feel that he owes nothing. I have been through all kinds so this is not shocking me but at the very least they all seem to pitch in on the food and permit costs without hesitation?



This will in no way deter me from taking never evers as I really enjoy taking them down these awesome places!

[caverdan]

That seems very reasonable for the cost of the trip. Like you point out. He is now on your "do not boat with" list. Next time warn people of the cost and maybe collect some of the fee up front from new participants you haven't boated with before. That could "weed" someone out like this person.

I'd say....... they are the ones smoking something here.

[lmyers]

I agree with all the above posts. The cost seems extremely reasonable, and definitely not anything to complain about. Dude is a cheap ass, plain and simple.

[griz]

A dude deadbeating on a $25 a day, just-show-up raft trip...Bwahahaha!!!

And yeah, second the practice of communicating costs before the trip to make sure everyone is in the same page and weed out any fucksticks beforehand.

It’s not worth the time but send him a link to how much a commercial trip costs for the same trip, too. It usually puts a grin on folks’ faces for the incredible value of a just-show-up private raft trip.

[matt man]

Originally Posted by lmyers

I agree with all the above posts. The cost seems extremely reasonable, and definitely not anything to complain about. Dude is a cheap ass, plain and simple.

Yep, I second that.

Sorry to hear it mdt67, that’s crap on his end, and your not being at all unreasonable.

[Will Amette]

I don't want that guy on my trips either. I do like having a new-to-river-travel participant on my trips when I can. I've NEVER run into anyone who thought there was no cost.


I did a trip several years ago and we carpooled four people in one car to save on driving and gas. When we were done, the car owner decided the driving cost should be the IRS reimbursement rate for using a personal car for business. It would have been cheaper to drive the two of us in my truck! We did get that settled amicably, and we're still friends. I always like to pay the car owner at least SOME towards wear and tear in addition to a share of fuel cost. Some friends refuse it, so I have to find a way to get them something instead.



Always a good idea to make sure everybody is on the same page for costs so there's no surprises. It's also a great idea that I almost always fail to do to ask anyone to pay a fee up front to cover some of their costs. That helps if someone decides last-minute to bail on the group when the group already has bought food... and might now need to buy another meal, but generally have too much of what is already bought.



Similar issue, but not about rivers.... I also keep forgetting not to pay contractors a final payment until the job is done. I just got bit by that again. I was going to be an early customer of a friend who started a painting business. We had a little delay on the final part of the job, but she was having cash flow issues, so I went ahead and paid her for completing the job. I had paid half up front, which was fair. Well, after delay after delay with no communication about it, she came by yesterday while I was at work and took her tools away. I guess I get to scrape, caulk, and paint the last quarter of the damn house and eat her cost because she's also refusing to reimburse me what I overpaid for a job not completed. Too bad because she really had attention to detail on the work she DID complete, although I'm concerned about some of the prep because there's already bubbling.



I hate this crap. I think I need a river trip. Only a couple months until permit lottery season. Good luck everyone, and just invite good people on YOUR next trip!

[MNichols]

Originally Posted by lmyers

I agree with all the above posts. The cost seems extremely reasonable, and definitely not anything to complain about. Dude is a cheap ass, plain and simple.

I agree as well, a hundred bucks for a 4 day trip? I WISH I could do it that cheaply these days, not to mention gas / fuel to and from and the shuttle.

[portermoab]

I hope your friend really enjoyed the trip as he should never get invited on another one.