Camp Consultant App-Grand Canyon (was GC0000-0010) - Page 3 - Mountain Buzz
 



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Old 01-17-2020   #21
 
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Its me. The skull was in the shrine at Westwater one year. Hopefully I'm looking a little better, unless you have x-ray vision.

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Old 01-17-2020   #22
 
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Originally Posted by jbolson View Post
While two numbers (mean and deviation) for each date would capture all the info, as you state. I'm curious if you can distill it down to one number, namely the average deviation. The question becomes how much does the deviation change with the day of the year. I'm sure there will be some variation, but you might find the variation is minor compared to the difference in average deviation between camps. If so, you got one number (or two, one for morn and one for night) for each camp.

If you are trying to decide between a few candidate camps, knowing if the camp gets late sun or early sun relative to your other candidate camps would be great info. On river time, the absolute time of day is unknown to most except the anal TL.
I'll have to think about what only one number can express with regard to camp selection and solar optimization. Really gets into expressing skew if you try to use deviation and that is total pocket protector stuff for an engineer (like you!).

There is a lot of variability by camp and season which you should examine. I have a pdf that I generated of camps as far down as owl's eye for you to ponder if you like. It is a version that is very old but adequate. Let me know if I should send it.
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Old 01-17-2020   #23
 
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My zero point was determined using multiple sets of air photos as on the beach shore ward of the bow of tied up boats at what was(is) the primary tie up of a camp. My zero elevation was heavily weighted by GCMRR's river elevation, the digital elevation model and having been to most of the camps often more than once.
Bummer, at every turn I feel as if I continuously rowing upstream or peeing into the wind with regard to my zero point. I likely spent hundreds of hours spotting zero points 20 years ago.

Obviously, the true bible of camp coordinates, and all other boater related coordinates, is Tom and Dwain's Rivermaps. Therefore, rather than introduce another set of coordinates that will only inject confusion I'm going to convert my zero points to correspond to Rivermaps. Rivermaps will also be more centered on a "kitchen", "group" or "common" area than my original logic of bench front focus.

This will likely set back progress for days but hopefully down the road save days
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Old 01-20-2020   #24
 
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GC0000-0020

Attached are graphs for camps between river mile 0 and river mile 20.

Zero point and mile markers are set to Rivermaps coordinates.
Attached Files
File Type: pdf GC0000-0020.pdf (2.13 MB, 26 views)
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Old 01-20-2020   #25
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ArcGIS

I'm thinking we need to get ArcGIS involved here. I've used it to calculate solar gain for optimum solar collector position.

When I'm at my other computer, I'll mess around. We could deploy this as an app which shows the camps on a map. Enter date and then a slider for time of day to show early or late solar gain.

LOL
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Old 01-20-2020   #26
 
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Originally Posted by Flaco View Post
I'm thinking we need to get ArcGIS involved here. I've used it to calculate solar gain for optimum solar collector position.

When I'm at my other computer, I'll mess around. We could deploy this as an app which shows the camps on a map. Enter date and then a slider for time of day to show early or late solar gain.

LOL
Kool Flaco,

I do ArcGis but only to general maps. I'd really enjoy discussing this further if you are serious(or not).
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Old 01-21-2020   #27
 
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I remember Brown's Inscription as a great afternoon camp in January. Very accurate.
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Old 01-21-2020   #28
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Kool Flaco,

I do ArcGis but only to general maps. I'd really enjoy discussing this further if you are serious(or not).
I just need to make time to figure on it. First step would be to find a a good raster layer with which to start. I'm pretty much a hack with ESRI but I have their software.

Ken
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Old 01-21-2020   #29
 
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I just need to make time to figure on it. First step would be to find a a good raster layer with which to start. I'm pretty much a hack with ESRI but I have their software.

Ken
Oh,,,, I understand.

Actually, I'm little more than a very, very experienced hack with ESRI.

As required by geologic consulting I have DRG, DEM and NAIP for all of North America(and to a lesser extent perhaps the world). Let me know what you might need,,,, simplified to northern AZ.

Let's discuss.
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Old 01-21-2020   #30
 
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Originally Posted by Infidien View Post
I remember Brown's Inscription as a great afternoon camp in January. Very accurate.
Wow, sun in January from 11:30 until 4:00 clipped at 3:00. Magical!

Out to mile 20 which I have posted;;; precisely corrected to GMT and repositioned to Rivermaps; I'm feeling with all humility aside: pretty precise.

I have Google Earth Street-View/ground truthed EVERY camp out to mile 20. By this I mean Google Earth has the entire Grand Canyon street viewed from a mid river perspective. CHECK IT OUT if you have not already.

With minor mental adjustment to Rivermap coordinate perspective, horizons are spot on.

I have total faith now in solar paths.

This is something you can precisely plan by if it matters.
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