The Greatest Generation versus the most selfish Americans - Mountain Buzz
 

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Old 04-18-2020   #1
swimming
 
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The Greatest Generation versus the most selfish Americans

So much was asked and delivered by the "Greatest Generation". Those who existed during and endured WW2.

My mother told a story of collecting ration stamps from neighbors to see my father, her recent husband, returning from the South Pacific. She had to travel from Georgia to Missouri. She didn't make it if not for the kindness of a gas station that provided her nearly bald tires to complete the trip.

My father left for the south pacific to fly in P-61's. Not a single plane survived and most aircrews were lost in that deployment he was returning from.

Our country asks much of some times and very little at other times. Mostly it expects of us to be a community considerate of easy and hard times.

I'm saddened by the response of many to a time of relative ease that all that is asked is to help your fellow Americans and cooperate to reduce unnecessary death. Yet certain Americans consider such a simple request a gross inconvenience that they will defy with their every word and deed.

The saddest aspect of this is that so called "patriots" consider themselves patriots with their acts of defiance.

I welcome them to move their defense to here were others can voice their differing perspective.

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Old 04-18-2020   #2
 
Denver, Colorado
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Comparing the liberation of Europe and Nazism to covid 19 is beyond fucking idiotic.

It’s an insult to your parents and my grandparents. This isn’t a battle for the fate of humanity, or to correct a great evil that is attempting to cover the earth. It’s a virus that’s killed some people and we possess the science to conquer. This idea that no one is staying home is not accurate. Millions of people don’t have work Ron, the interstates are empty, the mountains are closed. The collaborative effort to enforce and close this stuff down is unprecedented. Guess what man, people will die. Maybe lots of them, that’s real life and while unfortunate, it cannot be stopped. Maybe you’re one of them, maybe I am. If you’re doing you’re stay at home measures then if you contract and die it certainly won’t be because .00001% of the population is going out to float deso in a group of 7.
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Old 04-18-2020   #3
 
Denver, Colorado
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Sorry, that first one came off a little personal which was not my intent.

I would challenge your assertions simply by stating that to me, a very small (very very small) portion of the population is intentionally going out and disregarding the rules set forth by their state governments. Is there some gray area? I would say absolutely, I mean what is really essential vs non-essential?

I think that people are just looking for an outlet and while we all say what we are going to do oftentimes we don't end up doing those things because of peer pressure we receive from those closest to us, not people on the internet. I'm assuming based on your previous posts that you are older/retired and this probably scares you a lot more than it does me. I respect that, hopefully you are in a situation where you feel safe and are able to get the things you need in your life (like groceries) without going to the stores yourself. I know in our neighborhood those of us that are younger and working volunteer to get items for people that are more at risk.

I think working together in that type of accord is much more productive than arguing about what the rules should or shouldn't be. To me, the underlying point of all of this is to allow people that need our protection most, to be given as many resources as possible to extend that protection.
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Old 04-19-2020   #4
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Yes, I'm older and retired and have more to fear. However, there was much to fear when this bug made landfall in the U.S. As it turns out, our death rates and infection levels are among the worse in the world, if not the worse. If not for "true Patriots" who listened and trusted scientist this pandemic would have been much worse and many people would be complaining that we didn't act fast enough, which is happening anyway.

Yes, like your second post noted, many people are rising to the occasion and pulling together. Again, true Patriots.

Concerning gray areas. There are many. MNichols summarizes them very well in post #27 of this page:
https://www.mountainbuzz.com/forums/...tml#post768715

There are a few hard and fast requests by our "authorities" and one is to stay as close to home as possible. Another is please don't come here we can deal with you right now. When a few people openly defy such a critical requirements/requests necessary to end this pandemic then such things happen like "If you do it, I'll do it." and "He did it, why can't I." (then "Screw the Goberment, I'll do whatever I want."). Some people who do such things are called "scabs". In WW2 worse words were used. You do need to socially shame open violators of something as important as this.

And of course shortly Trump will throw the scientist responsible for saving 10's to 100's or thousands of lives under the bus just to pander to his wingnut base. So this brings up what able the next half of this pandemic or the next pandemic. How do we handle that?

Yes, people will die during a pandemic. In perfect hindsight, this pandemic may not turn out to be as deadly as early models projected(because of hyper vigilance?), but it ain't over so lets not consider that we have sufficient hindsight yet.
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Old 04-19-2020   #5
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Quick calculation based on last years 40,000 people killed by flu, COVID-19 is 4.5 times as contagious and 6 times as deadly.

40,000 X 4.5 X 6 = 1,080,000 dead people potentially killed by COVID-19 if no action taken. Yes dead people die but over a million dead people in our modern times is very scary(riot in the streets?). That is around one in every 300 americans would have died. Right now there are 1700 people logged into MB. Perhaps 6 of you logged in right now would be dead. Forgive me if I rounded a few numbers.

Now lets throw in another scary as hell consideration that some people may not develop immunity or that we never really eliminate this virus from our system. This horror is based upon very preliminary possibilities. These possibilities are too horrible to consider but if not his virus maybe the next, or, this virus in the fall?

Anyway "true Patriots" would want to do what ever they could to end this bug.
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Old 04-19-2020   #6
 
Albuquerque, New Mexico
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We may loose HUNDREDS of millions world wide to this media and Politically driven financial apocalypse. It is the sheeple going along with a terrifying and historic removal of rights not seen since Nazi Germany for a virus that could be managed with reasonable methods, such as isolated the vulnerable while the rest gain herd immunity. The only good I see out this may be the long awaited rise of the Libertarian party.
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Old 04-19-2020   #7
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Yes, I think many, many more republicans should vote for the libertarians.

They make great presidents as was proven by the last libertarian president. What was his name again?

Also, it is important to build upon the congressional base of libertarians. What is his name again?

But Libertarians are gaining ground with govenorships. What is the name of that currently seated libertarian governor?

I'd rather you vote republican than waste your vote on a libertarian candidate. I'm still very disappointed with friends that voted for Ralph Nader. Nader would have been much smarter to work within the Democratic Party(like what Sanders has done) than to be one of the most disliked people in recent history(at least in the Democratic Party world). Now he has no influence over anything. Even Ross Perot eventually blended into the republican party when he realized how ineffective a third party is.

Please suck it up and realize that the two party system will be here for a long time and that all you are doing is diluting the unified voice of the people who think most like you. It is like shooting yourself in both feet. That is, you get nothing more politically by voting libertarian; in fact you get less politically by voting against republicans. Bam, bam.
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Old 04-19-2020   #8
 
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"historic removal of rights not seen since Nazi Germany" ???

From 1933 to 1939 there were more than 400 decrees and regulations against Jews, most notably, the Nuremberg Laws of 1935. Such as:

right to own property, to keep money or possessions, to work in Ayrian sectors, to hold political office

Not to mention the right to dignity and life...

Source: Holocaust Encyclopedia/United States Holocaust Memorial Museum
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Old 04-19-2020   #9
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Thank you 2tomcat2 for beginning the appropriate shaming of "traitors", "scabs", "scums", etc.

Let me continue with the greatest generation. I'm the product of a military family. My father retired as a Colonel in the Air Force as Operations Officer at Little Rock Air Force Base of a "Wing" of 18 ICBM's meant to protect us yet incinerate Russia. He ended up there after requesting anything other than dealing with "Nuclear Planning" officer at Selfridge AFB Michigan. A job that included your entire family was assumed radioactive dust. Great choice but at least in the latter job you got payback.

So the greatest generation lived with nightmares. I was young but heard from older siblings saying "Dad had nightmares again." I was forth of five and asked my mother much later about "nightmares" and certain why's about my father. In time she said she awoke my father saying "John, John,, you are not there!" My father in cold sweats was awoken mentioning the name of the best man at their wedding and others present at their wedding that were DEAD in the South Pacific.

What the F is being expected of you in 2020 other than to be thoughtful of others.
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Old 04-20-2020   #10
 
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I believe it is not about bullying or shaming, how we treat each
other now might just be the new “normal” and I for one, would
gladly welcome some peace in our world
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