Karl Rove, The Prognosticator - Mountain Buzz

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Old 08-31-2008   #1
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Karl Rove, The Prognosticator

Rove on Obama's VP Choices (pre-Biden selection_
"I think [Obama's] going to make an intensely political choice, not a governing choice," Rove said. "He's going to view this through the prism of a candidate, not through the prism of president; that is to say, he's going to pick somebody that he thinks will on the margin help him in a state like Indiana or Missouri or Virginia. He's not going to be thinking big and broad about the responsibilities of president."

Rove singled out Virginia governor Tim Kaine, also a Face The Nation guest, as an example of such a pick.

"With all due respect again to Governor Kaine, he's been a governor for three years, he's been able but undistinguished," Rove said. "I don't think people could really name a big, important thing that he's done. He was mayor of the 105th largest city in America."

Rove was sooooo close.....

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Old 08-31-2008   #2
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I think this points out one thing for sure. Rove is not an insider on McCains campaign.
"Yesterday I was clever and tried to change the world. Today I am wise and try to change myself." -Rumi
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Old 08-31-2008   #3
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Dude, watch the Republicans spin this (Bill Kristol already is contorting stuff he said about Palin specifically, and "inexperience" generally, to make Palin seem like the next Harry Truman).

It's fucking sick. I'm seriously thinking about ending my time being registered as a Republican. That party is fucking DEAD. It's Dobson's party now, and no one else's. Kiss his ring or die. I prefer death, thank you very much.

I have more foreign policy experience than Governor Hot Stuff.

Have you seen that she's under investigation for abuse of power - firing one of her appointees who would not fire her ex-brother-in-law? That's some shit, right there. McCain did not vet this person at all.

It's a sham. It's the worst political pick for Veep since Dan Quayle, and frankly is probably worse than Quail.

The religious right is elated about her pick (oh, anyone stop to wonder if it's good for the family for a 4-month old with Downs Syndrom to lose his mother to the campaign trail?)

Economic conservatives and foreign policy conservatives are seeing that McCain is impulsive and unserious.

He met this woman ONCE before last week, and it was last week when he was really considering her that the state moved ahead with her investigation into the abuse of power.

Did Dick Cheney pick this chic or what?

I'm absolutely incensed that McCain would try to pull this on me, not that I planned to vote for him anyway. I'm PISSED!
"self-aggrandizing jackass" - it says it right on the label
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Old 08-31-2008   #4
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The real reason behind McSames VP pick....
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Old 08-31-2008   #5
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This; within 72 hours....


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Old 09-01-2008   #6
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I've been trying, somehow, to make sense of the Palin pick. Initially, I thought "OK, this is a pathetic attempt to snag some disgruntled Hillary voters," but that silly thought quickly passed. What Hillary supporter is going to vote for a woman who is rabidly "pro-life" and an NRA worshipper... and fundie to boot?

Here's what I've concluded: the McSame campaign saw the Biden choice as a real threat in the debates. "How to de-fang Biden" factored into their bizarre calculus. If Biden were to be remotely condescending toward Palin in the debates, or even too tough, he'd get hit with, "he's picking on her because she's a woman".

She appeals to the Republican "base" with her anti-abortion, pro-oil, pro-gun positions. BUT... to the hard core of the "base" there's this little problem with her: she's a woman. A good chunk of the "base" Neanderthals are pretty sure she should be at home cooking supper for her man.

Overall, I'd say this shows McSame to be a cynical Washington pol who made a giant gamble and stupidly surrendered the one "issue" he was getting some traction with: the inexperience thang. That's gone. Yeah, Republican apologists will say, "but Obama is inexperienced and running for president. Palin is 'just' the VP candidate." Sure, except McSame is 72 yrs old with some health problems. Palin could easily end of president. Between the years 1841 to 1975, more than one-third of all U.S. Presidents have either died in office, quit, or become disabled.
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Old 09-02-2008   #7
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Slunk, best avatar I've seen in quite a while.

Rove wanted Mittens and McCain wanted Lieberman. Rove campained hard against Joe and made it obvious to McCain that it couldn't happen with the polls considering a pro-choice VP. McCain, being a Maverick, took a shot in the dark instead of bowing to Rove.

Rove holds grudges. I wonder what is going to happen to McCain. Think they will let him flounder and regroup for 2012?

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Old 09-02-2008   #8
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Originally Posted by Livingston View Post
Slunk, best avatar I've seen in quite a while.

Rove wanted Mittens and McCain wanted Lieberman. Rove campained hard against Joe and made it obvious to McCain that it couldn't happen with the polls considering a pro-choice VP. McCain, being a Maverick, took a shot in the dark instead of bowing to Rove.

Rove holds grudges. I wonder what is going to happen to McCain. Think they will let him flounder and regroup for 2012?

Rove will be in Hell by 2012 and McCain will be in an assisted living facility screaming at the orderlies, "Did I tell you about my time in the Hanoi Hilton? I was a gawdamned POW!"
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Old 09-02-2008   #9
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Actually, I was happy to see his pick. I've only heard small sound bites about what she stands for but a hockey mom who destroyed the encumbent governor based on a platform of ending political corruption sounds like what we need. I'll hold off judgement until the debates, but if it bears out, I'll probably vote for McCain with the hope that he gets assassinated or just keels.

As far as her stance on abortion, I can't say that issue is anywhere near the top of my priority list right now. I'd first like to ensure a country where we have any choice in any matter. That issue doesn't belong with the federal government anyway, why are we deciding our president based on it instead of demanding our activist judges keep their f$%king opinions to themselves?

Honestly, our foreign policy is so screwed right now that we can't do any worse if we elect someone who doesn't have any foreign policy experience at all. She just might say, "Wait a minute, how does occupying a foreign country with mercenaries who are immune from any laws bring peace to the region?" Combined with input from foreign policy advisors, maybe a woman's perspective with a son in the military will bring some sense back to Washington.

Then again probably not.
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Old 09-02-2008   #10
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Written by a Wasilla resident. As far as I've been able to gather, she's real. One could certainly argue that she's partisan, but she knows Palin better than any of us...


I am a resident of Wasilla, Alaska. I have known Sarah since 1992. Everyone here knows Sarah, so it is nothing special to say we are on a first-name basis. Our children have attended the same schools. Her father was my child's favorite substitute teacher. I also am on a first name basis with her parents and mother-in-law. I attended more City Council meetings during her dministration than about 99% of the residents of the city.

She is enormously popular; in every way she’s like the most popular girl in middle school. Even men who think she is a poor choice and won't vote for her can't quit smiling when talking about her because she is a "babe".

It is astonishing and almost scary how well she can keep a secret. She kept her most recent pregnancy a secret from her children and parents for seven months.

She is "pro-life". She recently gave birth to a Down's syndrome baby. There is no cover-up involved, here; Trig is her baby.

She is energetic and hardworking. She regularly worked out at the gym.

She is savvy. She doesn't take positions; she just "puts things out there" and if they prove to be popular, then she takes credit.

Her husband works a union job on the North Slope for BP and is a champion snowmobile racer. Todd Palin’s kind of job is highly sought-after because of the schedule and high pay. He arranges his work schedule so he can fish for salmon in Bristol Bay for a month or so in summer, but by no stretch of the imagination is fishing their major source of income. Nor has her life-style ever been anything like that of native Alaskans.

Sarah and her whole family are avid hunters.

She's smart.
Her experience is as mayor of a city with a population of about 5,000 (at the time), and less than 2 years as governor of a state with about 670,000 residents. During her mayoral administration most of the actual work of running this small city was turned over to an administrator. She had been pushed to hire this administrator by party power-brokers after she had gotten herself into some trouble over precipitous firings which had given rise to a recall campaign. Sarah campaigned in Wasilla as a “fiscal conservative”. During her 6 years as Mayor, she increased general government expenditures by over 33%. During those same 6 years the amount of taxes collected by the City increased by 38%.
This was during a period of low inflation (1996-2002). She reduced progressive property taxes and increased a regressive sales tax which taxed even food. The tax cuts that she promoted benefited large corporate property owners way more than they benefited residents. The huge increases in tax revenues during her mayoral administration weren’t enough to fund everything on her wish list though, borrowed money was needed, too. She inherited a city with zero debt, but left it with indebtedness of over $22 million. What did Mayor Palin encourage the voters to borrow money for? Was it the infrastructure that she said she supported? The sewage treatment plant that the city lacked? or a new library? No. $1m for a park. $15m-plus for construction of a multi-use sports complex which she rushed through to build on a piece of property that the City didn’t even have clear title to, that was still in litigation 7 yrs later--to the delight of the lawyers involved! The sports complex itself is a nice addition to the community but a huge money pit, not the profit-generator she claimed it would be. She also supported bonds for $5.5m for road projects that could have been done in 5-7 yrs without any borrowing. While Mayor, City Hall was extensively remodeled and her office redecorated more than once. These are small numbers, but Wasilla is a very small city.

As an oil producer, the high price of oil has created a budget surplus in Alaska. Rather than invest this surplus in technology that will make us energy independent and increase efficiency, as Governor she proposed distribution of this surplus to every individual in the state. In this time of record state revenues and budget surpluses, she recommended that the state borrow/bond for road projects, even while she proposed distribution of surplus state revenues: spend today's surplus, borrow for needs. She’s not very tolerant of divergent opinions or open to outside ideas or compromise. As Mayor, she fought ideas that weren’t generated by her or her staff. Ideas weren’t evaluated on their merits, but on the basis of who proposed them.

While Sarah was Mayor of Wasilla she tried to fire our highly respected City Librarian because the Librarian refused to consider removing from the library some books that Sarah wanted removed. City residents rallied to the defense of the City Librarian and against Palin's attempt at out-and-out censorship, so Palin backed down and withdrew her termination letter. People who fought her attempt to oust the Librarian are on her enemies list to this day. Sarah complained about the “old boy’s club” when she first ran for Mayor, so what did she bring Wasilla? A new set of "old boys". Palin fired most of the experienced staff she inherited. At the City and as Governor she hired or elevated new, inexperienced, obscure people, creating a staff totally dependent on her for their jobs and eternally grateful and fiercely loyal--loyal to the point of abusing their power to further her personal agenda, as she has acknowledged happened in the case of pressuring the State’s top cop (see below).

As Mayor, Sarah fired Wasilla’s Police Chief because he “intimidated” her, she told the press. As Governor, her recent firing of Alaska's top cop has the ring of familiarity about it. He served at her pleasure and she had every legal right to fire him, but it's pretty clear that an important factor in her decision to fire him was because he wouldn't fire her sister's ex-husband, a State Trooper. Under investigation for abuse of power, she has had to admit that more than 2 dozen contacts were made between her staff and family to the person that she later fired, pressuring him to fire her ex-brother-in-law. She tried to replace the man she fired with a man who she knew had been reprimanded for sexual harassment; when this caused a public furor, she withdrew her support.
She has bitten the hand of every person who extended theirs to her in help. The City Council person who personally escorted her around town introducing her to voters when she first ran for Wasilla City Council became one of her first targets when she was later elected Mayor. She abruptly fired her loyal City Administrator; even people who didn’t like the guy were stunned by this ruthlessness. Fear of retribution has kept all of these people from saying anything publicly about her.

When then-Governor Murkowski was handing out political plums, Sarah got the best, Chair of the Alaska Oil and Gas Conservation Commission: one of the few jobs not in Juneau and one of the best paid. She had no background in oil & gas issues. Within months of scoring this great job which paid $122,400/yr, she was complaining in the press about the high salary. I was told that she hated that job: the commute, the structured hours, the work. Sarah became aware that a member of this Commission (who was also the State Chair of the Republican Party) engaged in unethical behavior on the job. In a gutsy move which some undoubtedly cautioned her could be political suicide, Sarah solved all her problems in one fell swoop: got out of the job she hated and garnered gobs of media attention as the patron saint of ethics and as a gutsy fighter against the “old boys’ club” when she dramatically quit, exposing this man’s ethics violations (for which he was fined).

As Mayor, she had her hand stuck out as far as anyone for pork from Senator Ted Stevens. Lately, she has castigated his pork-barrel politics and publicly humiliated him. She only opposed the “bridge to nowhere” after it became clear that it would be unwise not to. As Governor, she gave the Legislature no direction and budget guidelines, then made a big grandstand display of line-item vetoing projects, calling them pork. Public outcry and further legislative action restored most of these projects--which had been vetoed simply because she was not aware of their importance--but with the unobservant she had gained a reputation as “anti-pork”. She is solidly Republican: no political maverick. The State party leaders hate her because she has bit them in the back and humiliated them. Other members of the party object to her self-description as a fiscal conservative.

Around Wasilla there are people who went to high school with Sarah. They call her “Sarah Barracuda” because of her unbridled ambition and predatory ruthlessness. When Sarah's mother-in-law, a highly respected member of the community and experienced manager, ran for Mayor, Sarah refused to endorse her. As Governor, she stepped outside of the box and put together of package of legislation known as “AGIA” that forced the oil companies to march to the beat of her drum.
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