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Old 11-14-2008   #1
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Floating With (or Without) Jesus

Words to consider from an anonymous post on the blog of Dear Hunting with Jesus author Joe Bageant:

"The primary task of serious progressives over the next few months must be to prevent progressive votes of this Tuesday from being turned into another corporatist victory. No one should be very hopeful for the prospects of such an effort. I suspect as progressives spend their time fighting over tickets to the inaugural ball, the Wall Street and K Street branches of the Democratic Party will win the war of priorities and ideas of the new Obama Administration in a rout.
***
"In a system, which is entering a period of semi-permanent crisis, to plant oneself or one's party in its political center is to make yourself responsible for a political system which is forever failing, losing legitimacy and eventually its right to rule. In the long run, the future will belong to whichever political force flies the boldest flags, stands credibly far enough from those who will be held accountable for our troubles, and curses the loudest at the coming darkness."

Joe Bageant: Sarah Palin is the Future of Conservatism

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Old 11-14-2008   #2
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Her selection was an attempt to make the election about the culture wars, and it nearly worked. Absent the timely melt down in Wall Street it would have likely led to a John McCain victory.

For any one who doubts the transformative nature of what Palinism signifies for the conservative movement, one needs to look no further than the negative reaction of so many prominent conservatives to the Palin nomination. From Peggy Noonan to Andrew Sullivan to many of the propagandist scribes of the National Review, her appointment was savaged as symbolizing the death of a certain kind of conservatism, which in fact was very much true.
As I myself am an arrogant bastard politically, I have to say: that's one arrogant bastard.

I am always on the lookout for people who whitewash Bush 43 with Reagan. The two could hardly be much different, either temperamentally or politically. And this author start off very quickly painting Rovean politics backward onto Uncle Ron. I don't think very many liberals understand Reagan in context of the time in which he governed, but that's not something to be debated here.

It is true that Palin's nomination was the symbol of the culture war as it existed this year. But that doesn't mean she is the symbol of future conservatism. Indeed, she's hardly a conservative in the Reaganesque sense, or in the sense of the movement's great philosophers. Palin was the Rovean gambit.

It remains to be seen whether she was the last gasp of Rove's genius... That's for the Republican party to decide. Because I use history as my guide, I say that the Republican party will slip a little deeper into the Christianist tank, which will lead to heavier defeats in the next few cycles (2010, 2012, 2014).

What I truly dislike is the static nature of the writer's view. He assumes that this is what it means. He also has an extremely limited understanding of what the conservative movement really is, as evidenced by his admonishment of Peggy Noonan and Andrew Sullivan, calling them "defenders" of the way things have come to be. That's like calling Obama a pal of terrorists...

The linked-to article is a pretty smug condescension to anyone who has taken a philosophical interest in the conservative movement in US History since the end of the McCarthy era. Left me with a pretty bad taste in my mouth.
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Old 11-14-2008   #3
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The more interesting question is: What is now transpiring and what will happen in this progressive period?

Will the Dems replace run right no matter what with run left no matter what? Will it be read and run? Will it involve scouting the hard stuff and making choices? Combination of strategies?

I think his 'death of conservatism' take is interesting, but really is a minor point on the current irrelevance of conservatism, brought on by the Palin-style narcissism and condescension of the right. Just ask Joe the Plumber.

In other words, I'm bored with yells of "run right" "run right" from the dogmatic right which doesn't look back while righting its boat for another blind run down the right. By comparison, the thoughtful conservatives sit gobstruck, flipped, scattered, and wrapped on a simplistic run-to-the-right-no-matter-what dogma.

I'm definitely not bored with hearing the read of thoughtful conservatives on the current progressive period. Might be some lessons learned which could help us all.
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Old 11-14-2008   #4
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I'll tell ya where I agree with some of his writing, and something you said: Sean Hannity is an effing c**k, man. Props to Rush who does it with aplomb and a sense of humor, but Hannity has no redeeming value as an on-air personality to me.
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Old 11-14-2008   #5
 
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Props to Rush who does it with aplomb and a sense of humor...
Here's some of Rush's really "funny" stuff.

“Feminism was established to allow unattractive women easier access to the mainstream.”

“Liberals attempt through judicial activism what they cannot win at the ballot box."

“The most beautiful thing about a tree is what you do with it after you cut it down.”

“When a gay person turns his back on you, it is anything but an insult; it's an invitation.”

“They [women] vote with their vaginas.”

“[Democrats] don't have reasons for people to vote for them. They're just trying to gin up anger and resentment for their opposition. And it's just not working anymore.”

"He is exaggerating the effects of the disease. He's moving all around and shaking and it's purely an act. ... This is really shameless of Michael J. Fox. Either he didn't take his medication or he's acting."

"And don't forget, Sherrod Brown is black. There's a racial component here, too. And now, the newspaper that I'm reading all this from is The New York Times, and they, of course, don't mention that." --on the 2006 Ohio Senate primary race involving then-Rep. Sherrod Brown (D-OH), who is white

"This is no different than what happens at the Skull and Bones initiation...I'm talking about people having a good time, these people, you ever heard of emotional release? You ever heard of the need to blow some steam off?" --on the Abu Ghraib prisoner abuse scandal

"The NAACP should have riot rehearsal. They should get a liquor store and practice robberies."

I mean, let’s face it, we didn’t have slavery in this country for over 100 years because it was a bad thing. Quite the opposite: slavery built the South. I’m not saying we should bring it back; I’m just saying it had its merits. For one thing, the streets were safer after dark.

You know who deserves a posthumous Medal of Honor? James Earl Ray [the confessed assassin of Martin Luther King]. We miss you, James. Godspeed.

Look, let me put it to you this way: the NFL all too often looks like a game between the Bloods and the Crips without any weapons. There, I said it.

They’re [blacks] 12 percent of the population. Who the hell cares?

Take that bone out of your nose and call me back (to an African American female caller).

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Old 11-14-2008   #6
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Meet the new bosses, same as the old bosses?

Obama-Biden Transition: Agency Review Teams | Change.gov
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Old 11-14-2008   #7
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Its not clear weather you agree or disagree with the author of the link you posted... but he (the author) is clearly delusional like many of the right wing. Palin is the past, not the future. the sweeping obama victory sent a message loud and clear that the right wing lost its culture war. why they want to go back to that is incomprehensible. I don't think many of my right wing friends really understand what happened. Things in America will NEVER be the same. We aren't going back we are going forward. FUD (Fear Uncertainty and Doubt) doesn't work anymore. Only small minds are going to try to hold on to the disastrous policies that brought us the last 8 years. Palin is more of that if not worse. The sooner the righties realize this the better.

Finally I have this to say. If you could at least find someone with half a brain we might be more interested. I will bring up Romney again: the guy is smart - he can run a business and I have the feeling he could run a country - despite his crazy beliefs. Palin on the other hand - has crazy beliefs and is dumb as a bag of rocks when it comes to running the country, foreign policy, answering basic questions. She would be extremely dangerous to our country. Why do palin lovers hate america so much as to risk its very future by supporting this quite obviously ignorant person? as much as I think someone like cheney is evil at least he has some smarts about him.

bottom line - if you think palin is fit to run this country you really ought to get out cause you scare the hell out of a lot of rational people. maybe you could move to alaska and support the secessionist movement.
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Old 11-14-2008   #8
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Mania, you're engaging in thinking an election is an absolute measure. An election is like a CFS reading on a river. It changes, and the river can be quite a bit different at really arbitrary measures.

The culture war is not over. FUD is not necessarily proven ineffective. Things could very well be the same as 2004 in 2012.
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Old 11-14-2008   #9
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I have to admit, I feel a little bit like a forum whore when I post two replies in a row. But then I remember that I'm just that damn important

Fascinating accounts of the transition to the electorate as seen in the snapshot of this election. The implications to Republicans are alarming (if they're honest with themselves).

Money:
Quote:
One key to Barack Obama's victory, however, was his overwhelming support among voters ages 18 to 29, whom he won by 34 points, 66 percent to 32 percent; and his support among those ages 30 to 44, whom he carried by 6 points, 52 percent to 46 percent. Those numbers are ominous for Republicans looking to 2010 and beyond.
Remember that if you were 24 in 2008, you were 16 in 2000, when BUsh took office. You were 17 when 9/11 happened, and you were 19 when Iraq was invaded. These kids don't remember the Gulf War (one), they have no concept of Vietnam (till Iraq) and absolutely no memory of the Cold War that is meaningful.

They're understanding of Republican foreign policy doesn't look effective at all. In fact, it looks somewhere between reckless and incompetent. Fortunately for the GOP, the media has abrogated its responsibility to cover war in any meaningful way....

Money 2:
Quote:
Republicans have lost an enormous amount of support among upscale voters, basically just breaking even among those with household incomes above $50,000 a year, a traditional GOP stronghold. Similarly, McCain's losing to Obama among college graduates and voters who have attended some college underscores how much the GOP franchise is in trouble. My hunch is that the Republican Party's focus on social, cultural, and religious issues -- most notably, fights over embryonic-stem-cell research and Terri Schiavo -- cost its candidates dearly among upscale voters.
I don't want to channel Nietzche here, but the link between politics and religion in the current GOP platform is destroying conservative politics. Dobson is a political poison to the young and the intelligent. It's not that religion is an outdated notion, or that god is dead. It's that the organizations that are advocating public policy based on biblical interpretation are clearly intolerant of opposing viewpoints.

I'm not even saying that the major religions are intolerant; there are adherents who are sane advocates (of all religions and in all parties).

Herein is my particular remonstration against the GOP as it currently is seen:
The theocrats are ruining your party.
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Old 11-18-2008   #10
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Progressive Era

"Its not clear weather you agree or disagree with the author of the link you posted."

On the subject of the new progressive era, I agree that Obama is in progress of making important decisions on how to staff the Administration. Many under consideration are knee-jerk centrists and center-right devotees who may be very troubling to the knee-jerk lefties headed predictably left, and the pragmatic progressives and independants who are either doing the the read and run or are scouting the situation.

I also agree that the right is unredeemably narcissistic and profoundly obsessed with the next run down the right.
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