Which boat to buy? Burn, Remix, or Villian? - Mountain Buzz
 



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Old 07-04-2015   #1
 
Boulder, Colorado
Paddling Since: 2012
Join Date: Jun 2015
Posts: 6
Which boat to buy? Burn, Remix, or Villian?

I am looking for a new river runner/creek boat and am considering between these three:
Jackson Villian S (2011?)
Liquid Logic Remix 69
Pyranha Burn (Small, 2009?)

My info -
Weight: 125 lb
Height: 5'8"
Solid class III, and currently working through the easier class IV runs in the front range. I want a boat to help me progress my paddling.

I'm probably leaning towards the villian (most volume and forgiving edges).
Burn is much smaller and harder edges, remix somewhere in between, the way I see it. What's your opinion? Which boat and why?

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Old 07-04-2015   #2
 
Steamboat Springs, Colorado
Paddling Since: 1993
Join Date: Jun 2015
Posts: 11
None of those are good river runners.
Getting a creek boat to run rivers in like buying a mountain bike for the core trail.
Get an actual river runner, something like a Pyranha Recoil and log in miles of different rivers. Once your super solid on class IV, then look for a creek boat if that's what you're drawn towards.
At your size you can fit in anything. Look for used.
Enjoy the journey!
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Old 07-04-2015   #3
 
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San Tan Valley, Arizona
Paddling Since: 2014
Join Date: Sep 2014
Posts: 6
Quote:
Originally Posted by Riptilyaflip View Post
None of those are good river runners.
Getting a creek boat to run rivers in like buying a mountain bike for the core trail.
Get an actual river runner, something like a Pyranha Recoil and log in miles of different rivers. Once your super solid on class IV, then look for a creek boat if that's what you're drawn towards.
At your size you can fit in anything. Look for used.
Enjoy the journey!
I'm confused, while the Villian is listed as creek/big river, the other two (Remix & Burn) certainly are river runners...also, the Recoil that you mentioned is 'river-play' rather than 'river-runner', no?
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Old 07-04-2015   #4
 
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Buena Vista, Colorado
Paddling Since: 2005
Join Date: Jun 2008
Posts: 4,766
Yes. The Burn and Remix certainly are river runners and the Villain is more creeker. At your height, I would step up a size in each of them. Come up to BV and paddle couple demo's. Might also look at the Karma and Mamba....and you definitely don't have to be "super solid on class IV" to paddle any whitewater kayak...
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Old 07-04-2015   #5
 
Carbondale, Colorado
Paddling Since: 1985
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The Remix is a great river runner. Try the Mamba too. It will depend on which one fits you and which one you like. They paddle differently.
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Old 07-04-2015   #6
 
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Sylva, Western North Carolina
Paddling Since: 1981
Join Date: Mar 2011
Posts: 73
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Originally Posted by Riptilyaflip View Post
None of those are good river runners.
Getting a creek boat to run rivers in like buying a mountain bike for the core trail.
Get an actual river runner, something like a Pyranha Recoil and log in miles of different rivers. Once your super solid on class IV, then look for a creek boat if that's what you're drawn towards.
At your size you can fit in anything. Look for used.
Enjoy the journey!
WTF?

The Remix is a great river runner. I do Class IV in the Southeast with it. Ran The Numbers on the Ark at 1600 cfs with it. I took it down the Middle Fork of the Salmon. If I could have one boat, the Remix would be it.
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Old 07-04-2015   #7
 
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Sylva, Western North Carolina
Paddling Since: 1981
Join Date: Mar 2011
Posts: 73
Quote:
Originally Posted by nate158 View Post
I am looking for a new river runner/creek boat and am considering between these three:
Jackson Villian S (2011?)
Liquid Logic Remix 69
Pyranha Burn (Small, 2009?)

My info -
Weight: 125 lb
Height: 5'8"
Solid class III, and currently working through the easier class IV runs in the front range. I want a boat to help me progress my paddling.

I'm probably leaning towards the villian (most volume and forgiving edges).
Burn is much smaller and harder edges, remix somewhere in between, the way I see it. What's your opinion? Which boat and why?
I'm partial to the Remix. At your size and weight, stay with the 69. I'm 5'7", 165 and would not want a bigger Remix. If I could have one boat, the Remix would be it. I also have a Flying Squirrel and love it too, but that's another discussion.
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Old 07-04-2015   #8
 
Cascade, Idaho
Paddling Since: 1997
Join Date: Mar 2010
Posts: 19
Go for comfort

Good news: all of these boats are great designs. They are all good river runners and good creekboats. In reality, nearly every boat design since the Nomad has plenty of great characteristics in terms of handling, resurfacing, stability, etc. The Remix isn't really a great creekboat, but plenty of people crush hard creeks in them.

This may sound silly, but the single most important factor in choosing a kayak these days is outfitting and comfort. And everyone feels differently about every boat. Personally, I like Jackson outfitting. I know lots of people who done. Fine, good for them. Pick the boat you can feel comfortable in. You want to feel connected to the boat, have your knees high enough to get good circulation and edge control, and be supported in sitting upright so you can paddle well.

All the characteristics of the hull design of each boat is somewhat irrelevant, particularly at this stage of your paddling. Just like a bike or a car, spend some time in the boat and you'll quickly get used to it and continually develop your paddling style to match the way the boat handles. Someday down the road, you may decide you want to push your style in a direction that doesn't really fit the boat. There'll be plenty of cheap used creekers to choose from.
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Old 07-05-2015   #9
 
Steamboat Springs, Colorado
Paddling Since: 1993
Join Date: Jun 2015
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Originally Posted by BruiseLee View Post
I'm confused, while the Villian is listed as creek/big river, the other two (Remix & Burn) certainly are river runners...also, the Recoil that you mentioned is 'river-play' rather than 'river-runner', no?
For river running, you want a river/play. If you get a river/creek boat it will be a turd on the river. It may be stable, but it won't surf, squirt, etc... ie play!
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Old 07-05-2015   #10
 
Steamboat Springs, Colorado
Paddling Since: 1993
Join Date: Jun 2015
Posts: 11
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Originally Posted by spack171 View Post
WTF?

The Remix is a great river runner. I do Class IV in the Southeast with it. Ran The Numbers on the Ark at 1600 cfs with it. I took it down the Middle Fork of the Salmon. If I could have one boat, the Remix would be it.
I think a good river runner should also be playful.
The Remix is a good stable boat, better suited to class V.
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