Karnali VS Remix . . . again - Mountain Buzz
 



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Old 08-07-2011   #1
 
West Linn, Oregon
Paddling Since: 2006
Join Date: Jul 2011
Posts: 31
Karnali VS Remix . . . again

I have read a quite a lot of reviews with these 2 boats and still have no difinitive answers. If you have paddled both could you please rate these 2 boats on these categories please.
for use as a river runner on class 3 by begginer / intermediate paddlers
scoring as 1'st, 2nd place how would you rate these two boats


1 primary stability
2. secondary stability
3 eddie control
4 easy of roll
5 acceleration
6 stability thru holes and boily / squirrely water
and last but not least, what boat flipped you more and why.

Thank you.
may this be the last time these 2 boats need to be compared.

as for me, short and heavy roominess not a factor

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Old 08-07-2011   #2
 
Blarney, Iowa
Join Date: Aug 2010
Posts: 537
Too lazy, but Remix >>> Karnali until you become an ace creeker. But then only maybe.
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Old 08-07-2011   #3
 
West Linn, Oregon
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LOL Anchorless you get a "C" for effort
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Old 08-07-2011   #4
 
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Riverdale, Utah
Paddling Since: 1977
Join Date: Apr 2007
Posts: 231
Demo them both . I've heard alot of good about them both. Love my new Villian too. There are several kayak shops with rentals or free demos in the Portland area, and lots of used boats too. At Alder Creek, you could probably take these boats out in the bay 100 feet from the shop, and answer 1, 2, 4, and 5 for yourself in an hour.

I haven't paddled a Karnali, but I don't think there will be huge differences between those boats. They are both considered to be fast, easy rolling, stable.. Beginners would flip more in playboats, and those will be somewhat harder to roll too.

Beginner/intermediates should practice their roll and brace every time they go out, and get good instruction if they need it. I see too many intermediates without a solid (and fast) combat roll. That is way more important than what boat they are in. A poor combat roll will lead to a scary swim sooner or later; then many tend to quit the sport, which is a shame.
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Old 08-07-2011   #5
 
West Linn, Oregon
Paddling Since: 2006
Join Date: Jul 2011
Posts: 31
I have demo'd both, but it was long time ago.
the Karnali I paddled in the flat water behind the store at Jansen beach.
the Remix I took on class 2.
I thought the Karnali was really tippy in flat water,
and the remix was so much like my huge boat the XP10, it didn't feel sporty at all. but this was a while ago and I have improved some since then. just didn't want to take both boats back out and wanted opinions from more advance paddlers.
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Old 08-07-2011   #6
 
West Linn, Oregon
Paddling Since: 2006
Join Date: Jul 2011
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BTW I too love the Villain, but I am looking to buy a boat that has shorter cockpit sides to accommodate my shorter upper body length. A lot of boats i have tried and liked were to tall for me, and gave me trouble with rolling.
boats like the super hero the sides were almost to my under arms. the Remix and the Karnali fit me pretty good.
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Old 08-07-2011   #7
 
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Riverdale, Utah
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"just didn't want to take both boats back out"- I don't follow; around here we would love to have free demos at a waterfront shop . Have you rolled them both?
Which size boats were you trying? Do you fit in a smaller size? Even the largest Remix will eddy turn much much better than an XP10.
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Old 08-07-2011   #8
 
West Linn, Oregon
Paddling Since: 2006
Join Date: Jul 2011
Posts: 31
Quote:
Originally Posted by wasatchbill View Post
"just didn't want to take both boats back out"- I don't follow; around here we would love to have free demos at a waterfront shop . Have you rolled them both?
Which size boats were you trying? Do you fit in a smaller size? Even the largest Remix will eddy turn much much better than an XP10.
really just looking for more qualified opinions.
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Old 08-08-2011   #9
 
Durango, Colorado
Paddling Since: 1996
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I have been paddling a Karnali L all season, mostly on Class 4 and 5. I have paddled a Remix 79, but only in really mellow water. For reference, I am 6'1", 165.

Primary stability- the Karnali is good but not as good as a total planning hull. The Remix felt very similar. Not surprising since both has a flat hull but a rounded chine.

Secondary stability- This is the Karnali's best feature. I literally have to throw my weight to get it upside down. However, the Remix felt very similar in this respect (once again similar hull shape).

eddie control- the Karnali has enough edge to engage when you want it to snap in and out of eddies, but the edges don't catch.

ease of roll- Karnali is really easy to roll. I think I actually might be able to hand roll it in real whitewater. Not sure about the Remix because it was cold out when I was paddling it.

acceleration- A great strenth of the Karnali- two strokes and you are up to speed. I would assume the Remix is also very good in this respect.

Stability through holes/ boily water- Karnali is insanely good. I don't think I have caught an edge all season. I paddled it on Cataract Canyon at 70,000 cfs and never flipped, so boils are no problem. I have done way less combat rolls this season that I have ever done before. If you could not tell, I love this boat. When I break it, I will probably just get another one. I think all the features that make it good in harder whitewater would make it a great boat to learn in. You really can't go wrong with either though. I would just sit in both a see which feels more comfortable on you. Good luck.
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Old 08-08-2011   #10
 
ashland, Oregon
Paddling Since: 2000
Join Date: Dec 2008
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Both are variations on the same theme. Get the one you're most comfy in or get the best deal on and spending time on the water in one will make the minor differences moot. I've been paddling a Remix going on three years and it's a great boat...rivers, creeks, self-support, it's amazing. I have a friend who does the same out of a Karnali and he feels the same about it.
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