Beware of Salmon River Rules and draconian enforcement - Page 2 - Mountain Buzz
 

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Old 01-30-2019   #11
 
gig harbor, Washington
Paddling Since: 1990
Join Date: Oct 2013
Posts: 24
I can take the heat. Lol. Thanks.

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Old 01-30-2019   #12
 
Boise, Idaho
Join Date: Aug 2015
Posts: 47
Suck you're going through all that. I honestly didn't know about that rule, so THANK YOU for posting publicly about it.
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Old 01-30-2019   #13
 
Boise, ID
Paddling Since: '99
Join Date: Aug 2004
Posts: 269
Quote:
Cancellation Policy – 21 days

To submit a cancellation, please login to your Recreation.gov account and select cancel.

Cancellations must be submitted no later than 21 days prior to your launch date to avoid the late cancellation penalty.

If your cancellation is within 21 days of your launch date, you will be restricted from the Salmon River’s control season lottery for three years.

No Show Policy

If you do not show up on your launch date, you will be documented as a “No Show.” Failure to submit a cancellation of your reservation also categorizes you as a “No Show.”

No Show Penalty

No shows will not receive a refund of any prepaid fees, and are restricted from holding a permit on this river for three years.
The rules seem pretty clear. But alas, the cancellation game. I see points on both sides of the story. If you're going to play, know the rules. Are the rules lame? Sometimes. Were they "applied" differently to you than they would be to anyone else? No. If you take one outside three weeks and dump it inside three weeks, yeah, no lotto apps for a bit. Should the ranger bend? Maybe. If they bend on that, what's the new precedent for bending?

As a guy who's played the on hold game waiting for a cancellation before it was all electronic, I'd be bummed if you beat for the permit that day and then dumped it. If I were you, I'd be pissed at missing a deadline by the day. Ultimately, short term pickups and dumping make it tougher for others to plan trips on short notice so I can see why they do it. You already had the trip moving so your sister "upgrading" the permit only helped you. Might have shafted people who couldn't plan on short notice. I wonder if your launch was used.

If I scored a Main cancellation a couple days before my sister's, I probably would have looked at launching prior on the river with people that could make it (or even by myself) and then joining up with sis's group downriver. Fairly common practice to do so. You get a much larger number of people that get to go together on "two permits". Or, you get two smaller groups that get more days on the river due to group size per permit. Opportunity missed in my opinion. Maybe the permits were too far apart.

Really, it doesn't matter what I think. I've been applying for 20 years now and have received one lotto permit. The chances are getting so slim, I more plan on an invite than getting a permit. And hey, if you were going for the same dates as me, you just increased my chances by 0.01% for the next three years. Thanks.
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Old 01-30-2019   #14
 
Rick A's Avatar
 
Henderson, Nevada
Paddling Since: 2007
Join Date: Apr 2016
Posts: 153
[QUOTE=flite;718441]Wah wah wah cry me a fuckin river......I'll raft it.

I fucking love this. I'm definitely going to use it. Sorry.
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Old 01-30-2019   #15
 
Colorado, Colorado
Join Date: Mar 2014
Posts: 122
Quote:
Originally Posted by fcaraska View Post
Be aware that you can be restricted from participation in the Four Rivers Lottery if you are unaware of how the rules are applied. If you pick up a cancellation permit with 22 days before launch day and cancel
It with 20 days left before launch, you will be banned from future lotteries. If you are holding a permit, for even the slightest amount of time, and the clock passes the 21 day window, you are in violation. Last year I got a cancellation permit with only 22 days before launch. My sister picked up one the very next day and her date was a better one. I immediately cancelled the permit. I never considered that holding a cancellation permit for less than 48 hours would prevent me from entering the lottery for three years. I spoke with the project manager, Nick, and he agreed that this was ridiculous. However, the Ranger, Ken, will not succumb to cimmon sense. I am not done fighting this. I will move up the chain all the way to the Secretary of the Interior if need be. Iíve been through too much for this land to not be able to enjoy it. Be careful when grabbing cancellations around the 3 week mark. Be safe out there.

It's your responsibility to read and know the rules and abide by them. In this case you didn't abide by them and you are paying the price for breaking the rules, and you want us to feel sorry for you? It's called being an adult, grow the fuck up and take your diaper off and put on some big boy panties.
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Old 01-30-2019   #16
 
gig harbor, Washington
Paddling Since: 1990
Join Date: Oct 2013
Posts: 24
You should apologize to every tree around you for wasting the oxygen they have produced.
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Old 01-30-2019   #17
 
gig harbor, Washington
Paddling Since: 1990
Join Date: Oct 2013
Posts: 24
Anyway, before your man pleaser starts up again you should know this was a warning for those that thought common sense would be applied to the rules. If you get a permit with only 20 days til launch day there is no penalty for keeping it until the launch day then cancelling. So, this makes no sense. So for those that assumed common sense would be applied I posted this as a warning to not go over the 21 day line even if you have a permit for an hour. I’m not asking any e to feel sorry for me.
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Old 01-30-2019   #18
 
bcpnick's Avatar
 
Salt Lake City, Utah
Join Date: Jul 2015
Posts: 197
Thanks for posting this. Even if you know the rules and follow them, that's a sneaky little thing to watch out for.
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Old 01-30-2019   #19
 
gig harbor, Washington
Paddling Since: 1990
Join Date: Oct 2013
Posts: 24
Is your profile pic the tree at North Canyon?
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Old 01-30-2019   #20
 
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Salt Lake City, Utah
Join Date: Jul 2015
Posts: 197
Quote:
Originally Posted by fcaraska View Post
Is your profile pic the tree at North Canyon?
No. It's from Halls Creek in Capitol Reef National Park.
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