Upper A, eh? - Mountain Buzz
 



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Old 07-05-2008   #1
Boof it like you stole it
 
G-wood Springs, Colorado
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Upper A, eh?

Has anyone used the train support for the Upper A this year? Do you still need someone to ride the train, or are the commercial boys thirsty for beer and eager to help??? We are two couples, all in kayaks, so asking for raft support is a little too much.
I'm not having much luck finding a website with real information about baggage drop offs. Help!?

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Old 07-05-2008   #2
 
Join Date: Apr 2004
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Coordinate w/ a comercial if you can. Beer usually does do it. If you have no one at the drop it may not get dropped, or it will get thrown. best to have it worked out. This is not one of the things the train likes to do, so getting info, even from the front desk, can be hit and miss.

When are you going?

E
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Old 07-06-2008   #3
Boof it like you stole it
 
G-wood Springs, Colorado
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Thanks Parker
We are looking to stay Saturday night. Do you have any experience with a helpful rafting company?

I was also thinking about previous posts on the Buzz, and if there are any nude rafting trips going to the Upper Animas this weekend, you'll probably need at least 4 safety boaters. We won't be 'going commando' ourselves, but you should have plenty of room for our gear if you're not packing any!
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Old 07-06-2008   #4
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I don't mean to be mean by any means, but the expenses for a commercial upper trip are not trivial. to run any single upper trip can easily run over $1000 for food, driver, gas, train tickets, guides, safety boaters, insurance, payroll taxes, income tax, permit fees, equipment. you think a 12 pack is worth it for us?
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Old 07-07-2008   #5
Boof it like you stole it
 
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Definitely not trying to take advantage of anyone, or any company.

I've worked with rafting companies from East Coast to West, and the companies that I've been involved with usually charge a fee to the customer that should easily cover the $1000 expense for food, driver, gas, payroll taxes, IRS Audit, and asian massage. Usually, river guides are there for the adventure, experience, lifestyle, and enough $$ to run the VW Van for a shuttle after work.

Don't mean to be mean, I'd like to know what company 'mania' is ASSociated with, so I don't bother them! Times are changin!
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Old 07-07-2008   #6
 
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I think what he is saying is that there are a lot of logistics and responsibility associated with getting gear to the train depot, on the train and off the train at Needleton (if that is where you are camping). What happens if the gear isn't there when you arrive - who's fault is that? Is someone suppose to sit around with it until you arrive?

I know the commericals are willing to help support private trips, but I do think it is worth more than beer to do so. The margins are tight on those kind of operations and I think the commercials get a little offended when you suggest they help with little compensation. We are paying our fair share for our private Upper A trip this week.

Why don't you go self-support expedition style or make a friend at the depot who would take your gear off the train. Plus how are you planning to get your gear out of the canyon?
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Old 07-07-2008   #7
 
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Durango, Colorado
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Uh, YOU were the person who was looking for something for NOTHING. Get a clue. The world doesn't exist to serve you. Didn't yer mammy tell you that?


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Originally Posted by boofyak View Post
Definitely not trying to take advantage of anyone, or any company.

I've worked with rafting companies from East Coast to West, and the companies that I've been involved with usually charge a fee to the customer that should easily cover the $1000 expense for food, driver, gas, payroll taxes, IRS Audit, and asian massage. Usually, river guides are there for the adventure, experience, lifestyle, and enough $$ to run the VW Van for a shuttle after work.

Don't mean to be mean, I'd like to know what company 'mania' is ASSociated with, so I don't bother them! Times are changin!
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Old 07-07-2008   #8
no tengo
 
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ah dsteve that is a little harsh. Its hard for kayakers to want to pay when they 'think' they can do it without a guide but its hard for us to deal with the freeload mentality as well.
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Old 07-07-2008   #9
 
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OK, I probably shouldn't have brought his mom into it. That was inappropriate. The notion that a small business is getting rich offa Upper A trips is pretty silly... as is the notion that a 12er is meaningful compensation for schlepping somebody's stuff.

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ah dsteve that is a little harsh. Its hard for kayakers to want to pay when they 'think' they can do it without a guide but its hard for us to deal with the freeload mentality as well.
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Old 07-07-2008   #10
 
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Upper A logistics

When this is a guided trip, considering that stern assists are run with a max of 6 ppl plus guide, and possibly a gear boat- there is very little profit margin, even for rafting.
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