Pyranha Machno or Waka Tutea? - Mountain Buzz
 

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Old 03-26-2018   #1
 
Bozeman, Montana
Join Date: Mar 2011
Posts: 96
Pyranha Machno or Waka Tutea?

Hello all,

I'm looking to buy a new kayak. A little about me: I'm 5'8", 138 lbs, female. I've been paddling about a year and a half, I have a Dagger Mamba 8.1 and a playboat (wave sport project 52). I paddle mostly in Wyoming, Montana and Idaho but occasionally elsewhere. I'm most comfortable on big water (Lochsa upper and lower, Grand Canyon, main salmon, etc.), and less comfortable on the rocky technical stuff (Gallatin, etc). I'm looking for a boat that's easy to boof and easy to maneuver to build my confidence in steeper more technical rivers.

The Lochsa is probably where I'll spend most of my time this year, and there's a good chance I'll do a self support trip on the main and/or MFS and other rivers.

I went to Chile this past fall and got to paddle a lot of different boats on a lot of different rivers which made me realize that I want a new creekboat. There were things about each of the boats that I liked but there were none that I would go buy right now. My favorite was the Zet Toro- I liked the speed and stability and most of all the big bow rocker, but ultimately it felt too big for me. I sat in the Zet Veloc (73 gallons), and decided it was way too small. My friend ended up using it the whole time (she's 5'1", 115 lbs) and she loved it. I also tried a Tuna, which I knew would be too big for me and it was. Next I tried a 9r. It felt like the right size and had the bow rocker I like, but it was so unforgiving. After nearly dying on the Maichin River and losing a paddle and the 9r overnight, I went to a zen, then back to my trusty Mamba, both of which lacked the speed and confidence of the other boats but after my experience on the Maichin I was back to paddling easier water anyway....

So now I'm looking for a new modern creeker. I want something forgiving with big bow rocker (I just love how those other boats skip over the holes instead of plowing into them), faster than my Mamba, big enough for self support. I've narrowed it down to two choices, neither of which are available for demo anywhere near me, so I'm looking for opinions on them- the small Pyranha Machno and the Waka Tutea.

All reviews that I've read for the Machno are glowing and it seems like exactly what I'm looking for, but I worry that I'm right in between sizes. Seems like everyone is saying to go a smaller for this boat because of tracking with the aggressive rocker. The Small is 73 gallons, same as that Zet Veloc that felt so tiny, but maybe the measurements vary between manufacturers? Would it work for self support trips? I sat in a medium at a local store- it did feel a little big but they didn't have any smalls.

The Waka Tutea is another that I've been looking at. All the cool kids around here are paddling Wakas these days, and I have sat in one-it fit like a glove. It's 79 gallons. It seems to have the features I want- the bow rocker, the speed-- but I worry that with the more aggressive edges that it would be not as forgiving as the Machno.

Has anyone paddled these boats? Thoughts?

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Old 03-26-2018   #2
 
Errywhere, Colorado
Join Date: Mar 2018
Posts: 9
So I may be able to help. I am 5'10 and 150. My boat of choice until last season was the Mamba 8.1. I love everything about it except for the speed, I still have not found a boat that whips into eddies better than the Mamba. Last season I bought a medium Machno on a friends recommendation. First off let me say it boofs bigger than anything I have ever paddled. Unfortunately, I found that it was difficult to make tight ferries and harder to catch eddies than my Mamba. I contribute most of this to the size of the boat and its lack of a super defined edge, so I ultimately decided to part ways with it. I am now the proud owner of a Waka Stout. I have yet to paddle it but the edge that runs the entire length of the boat inspires confidence and I am looking forward to the fact that it is between the sizes of the Mamba and Machno M.

Bottom line: The Medium Machno is big and it has soft edges compared to the mamba, it just wasn't for me. I'm banking on the Waka being more my style. Hope this helps
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Old 03-26-2018   #3
 
Bozeman, Montana
Join Date: Mar 2011
Posts: 96
Thanks for the reply, that's very helpful. It seems like the medium Machno is definitely out. I forgot about the Stout- that may be added to my list of boats that I want to try but can't.
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Old 04-04-2018   #4
White R. BC
 
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Durango, Colorado
Join Date: May 2006
Posts: 319
Hi Cookie, alright, boat shoping! Not to muddy the waters, but I would recommend u try the small Jackson Karma. I am about the same size (5'7" and 145#) and it seems just rt. Seems to fit your criteria also. it is super stable and v forgiving. It will flip but needs provocation and rolls fine. Seems fast esp accelerating into a boof. Has good bow rocker. Having mega bow rocker and speed are generally mutually exclusive, as having a longer water line (less rocker) is usually faster. Plenty of room for self support.

Lets see, what else: newest? coolest? Mmmm, maybe not so much but still a modern creeker and at least u should b able to demo one. Haven't seen a Machno much less a Tutea but comparing specs the Karma looks a little shorter, and narrower (important 4 me) w abt the same vol. May have slightly less bow rocker so may b a touch faster? More creeker/river runner but for the Locsa that would b better, also House Rk would b good 2.

Outfitting is pretty good but not up to the wave sport std so it takes a little work but like I said, u should at least b able to try it out. Have fun!

Oh, I don't have experience w the mamba either but a rockered boat needs different technique to feel zippy eddy dancing. U need 2 drive into the eddy a bit lower dn in order to have room for the bow to pivot and not smack the eddy rock because the hull will not engage the eddy water until the boat is farther into the eddy. Can't eddy out as high and tight. Same peeling out, u have to power out of the top of the eddy w speed cause u wont get into the downstream water till your feet/ankles cross the eddy line. Just a little dif
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Old 04-04-2018   #5
 
Boise, Idaho
Join Date: Nov 2003
Posts: 120
Quote:
Originally Posted by Cookie View Post
Thanks for the reply, that's very helpful. It seems like the medium Machno is definitely out. I forgot about the Stout- that may be added to my list of boats that I want to try but can't.
I'm 5'9", 150. I have paddled remix 69 for nearly a decade, a variety of smaller creekers before that. I bought a Waka Stout this year. I've got ~20 days in it on the NF Payette 900-1200ish. I LOVE this boat. It rips in and out of eddies, turns on a dime, boofs itself, and surfs like a champ. It has rails but seems just as forgiving as the remix. I haven't had it on real big volume yet (prolly this weekend as the NF just shot through the roof and rain is on the way...everything is likely to explode) but I've paddled smaller boats on big water and felt fine.

I loaned the stout to a friend last night who ran it down the NF @1200ish and said he thought is was great but perhaps a little slow. I don't know, I think it's just as fast as the remix 69...maybe I'm crazy. I loaned it to a gal who is average size and she thought it was too big. Finally, I know another gal (average height and weight) who has been in a tutea all year and is switching to the stout. So....take home is that the Stout is certainly one to take a real hard look at. If you were here in Boise I'd let you take it for a spin!
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Old 04-04-2018   #6
 
lookout mnt., Colorado
Paddling Since: 1989
Join Date: Feb 2008
Posts: 159
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Originally Posted by ID Surfer View Post
I'm 5'9", 150. I have paddled remix 69 for nearly a decade, a variety of smaller creekers before that. I bought a Waka Stout this year. I've got ~20 days in it on the NF Payette 900-1200ish. I LOVE this boat. It rips in and out of eddies, turns on a dime, boofs itself, and surfs like a champ. It has rails but seems just as forgiving as the remix. I haven't had it on real big volume yet (prolly this weekend as the NF just shot through the roof and rain is on the way...everything is likely to explode) but I've paddled smaller boats on big water and felt fine.

I loaned the stout to a friend last night who ran it down the NF @1200ish and said he thought is was great but perhaps a little slow. I don't know, I think it's just as fast as the remix 69...maybe I'm crazy. I loaned it to a gal who is average size and she thought it was too big. Finally, I know another gal (average height and weight) who has been in a tutea all year and is switching to the stout. So....take home is that the Stout is certainly one to take a real hard look at. If you were here in Boise I'd let you take it for a spin!
ID Surfer, I'm the same hieght but I've got 20 pounds on you, Stout or OG for me?
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Old 04-04-2018   #7
 
Boise, Idaho
Join Date: Nov 2003
Posts: 120
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Originally Posted by MCSkid View Post
ID Surfer, I'm the same hieght but I've got 20 pounds on you, Stout or OG for me?
Tough call.....You should definitely sit in both. I have 2 friends in the OG. One guy is ~5'10-11" and 190. He loves his OG. The other guy is similar size, maybe a little lighter and really likes his OG as well. If you're a strong paddler I'd say the OG might be the one. That said, the Waka website says the Stout was designed for Sven Lammler who is 5'7"and 170. Says the stout was basically built for him. The dude that paddled my stout last night has 10 pounds on me. He thought it was a little slow, but real nice other than that. That's about all I can say on the matter. Good luck!
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Old 04-04-2018   #8
 
lookout mnt., Colorado
Paddling Since: 1989
Join Date: Feb 2008
Posts: 159
Thanks ID Surfer, sounds like the stout might be the one.
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Old 04-11-2018   #9
 
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Technology Partner, Littleton, Colorado
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Cookie,
My son paddles for Pyranha and he recommends either the Nano or the 9R. Both are wicked fast, boof well, and catch eddies like a slalom boat. If you want to check these out. He'll be at the Paddle with the Pros day at Golden Games - PM me if you need more info
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Old 04-18-2018   #10
 
Salt Lake City, Utah
Join Date: Jul 2011
Posts: 6
In a similar predicament

I am also boat shopping (and have been for a while). I'm 5'5", 127 lbs, and have paddled a Medium 2nd gen Burn for years. Love my Burn but I'm assuming the grass is greener in Wakaland. My bf went from Burn to Tuna and looooves it. I do a lot of the same rivers as you and have similar requirements. I paddled a Nomad for a year and hated it (too small and slow), went back to my mangled Burn. Took a Jive on the Grand Canyon and loved it. I like speed and edges. I emailed Waka asking about the differences between the Stout and Tutea, and I was leaning towards the Tutea, but this thread has me second guessing....Here's the convo:

Me: "Hi, I'm trying to decide between a Stout and a Tutea. Do you know if there are any photos anywhere of the bottom of the Stout? Does it have edges all the way to the front like the OG? Is the Tutea still going to be better for big water? Thanks!

Waka: "I would suggest the Tutea to be honest.

The Stout is a super sweet boat for aggressive paddlers and less forgiving than the Tutea.

Both boats have edges from the front to the back but it is more that the stout has a low volume tail at the very end which can grab water more than the Tutea.

It is awesome if you are able to sink the tail and use this to help you boof. It has been made by the Lammlers for this reason and it is really up to you and how you paddle."
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