Deep and preachy thoughts ( - Mountain Buzz
 



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Old 09-01-2009   #1
 
Park City, Utah
Paddling Since: 1985
Join Date: Oct 2006
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Deep and preachy thoughts (

The buzz has changed a bit over the last five years or so. When it first started it was an awesome way to share adventures and often times put a face with a name on the river. Along the way a couple people started an east slope west slope thing that I believe was mostly in fun, but also was probably mildly associated with the lifestyle choices people made in living in the city and being weekend warriors, or living slope or river side and generally having a subsistence existence that went with that decision. That was largely egged on in pure humor by one damn funny individual who slammed on the front range while living there. (May he rest in peace)
This has grown into a one-up-man-ship. I'm the coolest kid on the block because I run class V cleaner than you. This year their was even some idiot complaining he had to save someone from another crew on the Big T. This is a change that is in stark contrast to what drew me into this sport. When I started boating I was struck by the acceptance and tolerance that other boaters had for each other. People took me under their arms and taught me so much while I provided laughter by missing lines and screwing up. That came over here in this site under Frenchy's loose supervision.

I'll ask all of you, am I just an old grouchy fart? Has the attitude here, or in the sport in general changed? What makes it okay to attack someone for sharing information about a rope in a river? Remember two people died in gore several years ago and many think that they were related to a rope caught slightly under the surface. When did we start second guessing our peers and not just assume they were doing there best to save each others asses.

Anyway, sorry for the rant, resume beating each other down.

Texas sucks! (Threw that in for Milo)

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Old 09-01-2009   #2
 
Denver, Colorado
Paddling Since: 2002
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Canada View Post
The buzz has changed a bit over the last five years or so. When it first started it was an awesome way to share adventures and often times put a face with a name on the river. Along the way a couple people started an east slope west slope thing that I believe was mostly in fun, but also was probably mildly associated with the lifestyle choices people made in living in the city and being weekend warriors, or living slope or river side and generally having a subsistence existence that went with that decision. That was largely egged on in pure humor by one damn funny individual who slammed on the front range while living there. (May he rest in peace)
This has grown into a one-up-man-ship. I'm the coolest kid on the block because I run class V cleaner than you. This year their was even some idiot complaining he had to save someone from another crew on the Big T. This is a change that is in stark contrast to what drew me into this sport. When I started boating I was struck by the acceptance and tolerance that other boaters had for each other. People took me under their arms and taught me so much while I provided laughter by missing lines and screwing up. That came over here in this site under Frenchy's loose supervision.

I'll ask all of you, am I just an old grouchy fart? Has the attitude here, or in the sport in general changed? What makes it okay to attack someone for sharing information about a rope in a river? Remember two people died in gore several years ago and many think that they were related to a rope caught slightly under the surface. When did we start second guessing our peers and not just assume they were doing there best to save each others asses.

Anyway, sorry for the rant, resume beating each other down.

Texas sucks! (Threw that in for Milo)
Amen, amigo -
I was afraid to post a safety hazard because I KNEW I would get a flame from at least one particular individual, and possibly more. Of course I posted it anyway, and sure enough, that very individual was the FIRST to respond, and responded in predictable fashion.
Good-natured ribbing between FRIENDS you know is cool. But flaming strangers on the Web SUCKS.
It's just like high school kids and such with cyber-bullying. So weak.
I think there is still a general excellence in the boating community - I love the camaraderie. It transcends other sports because we so often find ourselves counting on our buddies to come out of the thing alive, or for that matter counting on a stranger who's not really a stranger because he's a fellow boater.
I love boaters.
And this forum still has value, for sure ... but there are too many d-bags on here ... I'm reluctant to post trips, or for that matter a safety alert ...
But whatever.
The sport still rocks. Most of the people in it rock.
Let's go get some!
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Old 09-01-2009   #3
 
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Durango, Colorado
Paddling Since: 1996
Join Date: Jun 2005
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boating community in general

I was at a now prominent whitewater play feature two weekends ago. There was a wide variety of river craft present. While just scoping out the scene from the bank I witnessed several people swim and a raft with two older guys flip. No one helped. The old guys in the raft dump trucked in a hole and were still swimming around the next bend, which was at least five hundred yards away. I stood there astonished at the fact that not one person in the water even offered to help.
I don't know if it was the influx of beginners without any river etiquette or just the way that I was brought up paddling. If I had been in the water I wouldn't even have thought twice about offering help. Granted this area had minor or non existant consequences downstream, but still. We've still got to watch out for each other and provide a good example for the newbies. If people hadn't been supportive and helpful when I was starting out I would have had some bad times.
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Old 09-01-2009   #4
Self-Aggrandizing jackass
 
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The Ranch, Colorado
Paddling Since: 04
Join Date: May 2005
Posts: 1,134
My name is Helio and I'm a class IV boater with Class III confidence.

Did you know that something like 98 percent of wikipedia entries are edited by 0.2 percent of posters? My point is that really weird, sociopathic, hermetic, narcissistic, and dumb people have a heretofor unrivaled capability to 'express' themselves. The trick is not to let them harsh your mellow (btw, you get to decide which adjectives apply to me or any buzzard).

I've only met two cox on an actual river. Wait, scratch that; on the river they were reliable. Off the river they were cox.

This sport is still comprised of the coolest athletes (and non-athletic phatasses like myself) I've ever met.

The buzz is better than most websites for a group of affiliated nerds I've ever found.

Stupid is as stupid does. Maybe the Buzz should ban a few people who are clearly malcontents once in a while. I don't think that's a bad thing.

But overall, the vast majority of posts on the buzz are fun and/or helpful and/or harmless.

That's my take.
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Old 09-01-2009   #5
 
Durango, CO
Paddling Since: 1990
Join Date: Apr 2005
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Growing pains - good and bad. Growth in kayaking and other outdoor sports, growth in Colorado, commidification and consumption of the mountain lifestyle, etc..... Kayaking is a little less fringe, a little more mainstream and attitudes have changed. It's getting gangsta around here ( tongue in cheek / sarcasm). I still haven't figured out slimy stout brown whatever, but I do want Gnarquist's lifestyle (beer, babes, boating the gnar, hucking the meat, living the dream ) when I grow up. Good stuff. It's cool to see people firing up all this new stuff. And this POV stuff is frickin cool. Opinions are like______ and the buzz, like the rest of the world, has plenty of both. It would be nice if we could maintain a respectful, insightful online community, and that's up to the Buzzards. The thing I always liked about Frenchy's creations, unlike, say, TGR, is that there wasn't a presumption to flame anything & everything. A little bit of fun directed sarcasm never hurt anybody too bad. There has always been bro-bras in the sport, always will be. Reminds me of a story I read in the Telluride paper about a bro-bra skier who beat up a old fart in Bear Creek with his ski edges because the old dude didn't have appropriate BC gear in the bro's opinion, even though the old fart had been skiing in there for 30 years. The buzz will go the way of the Buzzards, let's hope we're cool enough to keep it real.

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Old 09-01-2009   #6
LSB
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Huson, Montana
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Being a Colorado boater then having spent a few seasons back east I found the boaters out there to be a lot more cliquish. The Yough in particular, not so much in Gauley Land. But it seemed that the locals had little use for each other much less outsiders. Rafters hating kayakers, squirtboaters too cool for school etc. I cut them some slack figuring that they had to pull too many out of town beginners out of the undercut rapids. Anyway, I think that as more and more boaters show up at your honey hole it gets easier and easier to be a hater.
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Old 09-01-2009   #7
 
Northern Colorado, Colorado
Paddling Since: 1993
Join Date: May 2008
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Ego and Aliases...

Hey, thanks for putting this topic out there. In part, I agree that there is a growing number of people on the river that are really intolerant and out for themselves. It doesn't really matter where they're from or what they do for a living, but they exist and anyone who's been around knows this. Back in the day-I'm talking early to mid 90s, people did look out for each other-regardless of if they were a class 5 guru or a rookie. There was a form of respect that was not based on a hierarchy of years on water or whatever, but on the fact that we were psyched to be on the water.
I miss that. Why is it that people should feel self conscious if they post a cool trip report on a class 2 river or a question?-that's not helping anything. There are a lot of issues surrounding the outdoor scene here in Colorado: crowds, level of ability, space to play, getting to and from the goods-hell, even keeping the goods a secret. But unfortunately, the reality is that there will be more people. More people can mean a greater awareness of the importance of our outdoor playground, and this can be a good thing. Let's (including myself), try to stop raggin' on each other.
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Old 09-01-2009   #8
 
Northern Colorado, Colorado
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Faucet Butt View Post
Hey, thanks for putting this topic out there. In part, I agree that there is a growing number of people on the river that are really intolerant and out for themselves. It doesn't really matter where they're from or what they do for a living, but they exist and anyone who's been around knows this. Back in the day-I'm talking early to mid 90s, people did look out for each other-regardless of if they were a class 5 guru or a rookie. There was a form of respect that was not based on a hierarchy of years on water or whatever, but on the fact that we were psyched to be on the water.
I miss that. Why is it that people should feel self conscious if they post a cool trip report on a class 2 river or a question?-that's not helping anything. There are a lot of issues surrounding the outdoor scene here in Colorado: crowds, level of ability, space to play, getting to and from the goods-hell, even keeping the goods a secret. But unfortunately, the reality is that there will be more people. More people can mean a greater awareness of the importance of our outdoor playground, and this can be a good thing. Let's (including myself), try to stop raggin' on each other.
Unless of course, if the person happens to be an egotistical asswipe and they deserve to eat shit!
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Old 09-01-2009   #9
 
North Bend, Washington
Paddling Since: 2009
Join Date: May 2009
Posts: 476
Thanks for putting this out there. I come here to learn from others expecially since there aren't many rafting forums, and I find posts that put down females, rafters and folks who don't regularly run class IV and V.

I'm in WA and from what I can tell, we're pretty mellow out here compared to the rest of the states. Anyone on the water is our friend and potential safety net. It goes both ways. I see a bunch of drunk guys on inner tubes w/ no PFD's and sure- I think "what an idiot", but even for that guy I'd save his ass if he needed it and I was able to.

I'd like to think that any of you would do the same for me.
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Old 09-01-2009   #10
 
Longmont, Colorado
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I wouldn’t let a few loud mouths on some website change your opinion of the general population of river runners. I bet if you were to survey everyone you ever see on the river the vast majority would have heard about but do not ever actually read this website. Take that down to the few people who are too cool for their own shorts and it’s probably less than .01% of Colorado boaters with an attitude, they just have a forum to post it in and an audience to read it. I’d even bet that most of them wouldn’t back it up by being a dick on the river, if someone was in need of help they would probably offer it without a second thought. Sure, anyone will be a little pissed if they had to put themselves in danger to save someone else who was too lazy or too ignorant to be properly prepared, I know I’ve been there.

I have met a lot of people on the river and quite a few through this website. All have been kick ass people that I’d be happy to call a friend.
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