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Old 02-16-2009   #21
I'm right 50% of the time
brendodendo's Avatar
Paddling Since: 1977
Join Date: Jul 2004
Posts: 857
We have this same discussion every year on this forum. Search for Saturn, Baltic, Canyon and you will find relevant posts.

BTT: Who do you work for or what shop do you own? I see lots of boats from you in the swap and am wondering why you have so many boats. Some are plain UGLY.

RM Rafts: Instead of arguing, post more pics, get us some testimonials of clients that are truly happy, etc. Lots of people on this board know lots of other people in the industry.

You are both marketing your products, lets see a show of friendly competition.

I do have a friend who went with Saturn. His wife loves it. I myself like Aire, but would go for a Sotar or Maravia.

I also had an incident on a Baltic. It was surfing after the floor took a hit and ruptured (unmanned while surfing). The T baffle hoding the Air chamber to the floor was ripped out and the air chamber was blown.
I swam out to it as it kicked out of the hole.. Thought I'd catch a bag ( see safety post). No paddle and had to ride it through the next rapid.
The floor felt like a giant foot trap. Don't know if Saturn makes the air chamber float over the self bailing glued in floor, but I for one, did not like the design.
Same thing went for the perimeter line. Each loop hung off the edge and was threaded through itself to create a big perimeter hazard. I cut it off the boat a few minutes after I got to the shore.

Claimer: Someone that makes a claim that they have been there and done that, can do anything you can do better than you. I hate "claimers"
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Old 02-16-2009   #22
Crested Butte, Colorado
Paddling Since: 2000
Join Date: Feb 2008
Posts: 36
brendodendo's post

Good advice. Thanks.

I'm not trying to hype the Saturn as the best raft in the world. However, for the price, I think it is the best quality raft you can buy, by a long shot. It has some issues I would still like to resolve. The one you mention, about the floor, is one of them. It works fine but I'm not a huge fan of it. The manufacturer is pretty good about working with me to get changes made. I'm open to suggestions on what type floor all you highly experienced rafters would recommend. Shoot me an email or give me a call with suggestions please. I was considering just having them glue the entire floor to the bottom of the boat. Any thoughts on that?

When I bought a Saturn 2 years ago it had some features that needed corrected. Before I said I would sell them I said they had to make some changes: removable thwarts, more D-rings, more self bailing holes, relief valve in the floor, get rid of the lifeline inside the boat, get rid of the hard handles on the side of the boat, etc. As per your advice, I've added a few pics to see the before and after shots. It's a much better boat than 2 years ago and I sell it at the same price. I am always taking inputs on making it better.

I gave a boat to Three Rivers Outfitters in Almont, CO last year and let them run it commercially for the summer. It held up great but the water was pretty high last year. The Taylor is usually pretty boney so problems, if any, should show up. Vito said he would run it a little harder this summer. I gave it to them because I want to see if it really can hold up well with a lot of use. They can put 3 years worth of a recreational rafter's wear and tear on it in one season.

As for testamonials, I'll get hold of some of the guys who have bought the boat and tell them about the forum. A lot of them are novice rafters and could learn a lot from the old heads that chime in.
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Old 02-16-2009   #23
southeast, South Carolina
Join Date: Feb 2009
Posts: 6
Nice row frame on the yellow one.

I can't say I've seen one of these off brand rafts in the SE. Price likely would be the only advantage, and while that's huge it's not everything.
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Old 02-16-2009   #24
Crested Butte, Colorado
Paddling Since: 2000
Join Date: Feb 2008
Posts: 36
True statement about the price. If you can afford a $4000 Hyside, congratulations! You have probably worked hard to do so. If you haven't been quite so successful or just can't talk the spouse into letting you shell out that kind of money, but still would like to have your own quality boat, check one of these out. As I said, I have only been selling and improving these for a little over a year. I hope to get some of you guys in the SE interested. I think you will be impressed with what you can get for our price.
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Old 02-16-2009   #25
caverdan's Avatar
C. Springs, Colorado
Join Date: Aug 2004
Posts: 1,443
I'm liking your placement of D rings. Are your only handles on the front and back? Nothing on the side?

What is the thickness of the material?

Does it come with extra material for patching when you purchase it?

Both my NRS Cat and Hyside Mini Mee came with matching material which has come in handy. Nothing more embarrassing than putting the wrong color patch on your pride and joy.

Sorry for all the questions more. Are you the only one putting the Saturn name on the side or are there other Saturn dealers out there?
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Old 02-16-2009   #26
leduc, alberta
Paddling Since: 2002
Join Date: Feb 2009
Posts: 9
hi there i to am looking at this raft i am up here in alberta canada and having a lot of probs finding a raft up here ! if any one knows of some where in canada that i can find a raft let me know? if i can get a good price from rmrafts with all the crazy shipping costs to canada i will be ordering one from him and maybe even talk about being a dealer up here i will suport this guy and any one else who sells saturn rafts
who knows maybe some day with all are help thay can be even better raft with a nice price thay may not be the best rafts but like rm said for us poor guys thay will get us on the river

thanks john
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Old 02-16-2009   #27
Crested Butte, Colorado
Paddling Since: 2000
Join Date: Feb 2008
Posts: 36
For Caverdan

One of the mods I had the factory make was to remove all the hard plastic handles from the side of the boat. They are knuckle breakers if you hit one while paddling. With the extra D-rings, I have a fairly taunt chicken line on the side of the boat and just have people grab onto it to help lift the boat. Not optimum but it was the best alternative I could come up with for now. I am working with the manufacturer to try and get some low profile, softer handles like you see on higher end boats like NRS and Hyside.

It comes with a patch kit with the same color material as the boat. The material is 1100 Dtex High Strength PVC. Chafers on top and bottom. I can always get you more material if you have a really bad tear.

There are a few Boats To Go dealers. They are the supplier and own the Saturn brand name. Like I said before, Saturn Rafts in ID is just another dealer. I will toot my own horn a little by saying I am the one who is responsible for all the mods you see made to the old Saturn to make them the better boat we offer today. See the pics on previous post.

I will keep taking your inputs to make it the best product we can and still keep it affordable so we all can enjoy the class IVs, a nice booze cruise with our honey, or an exciting day slaying some trout. I will meet or beat any other Saturn dealer in price and service. Come on up to Denver and you can take a look at one. Just give us a call.
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Old 02-19-2009   #28
leduc, alberta
Paddling Since: 2002
Join Date: Feb 2009
Posts: 9
well i talked with rm an i am ordering one best option i have here in canada
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Old 02-23-2009   #29
saratoga, Wyoming
Paddling Since: 1997
Join Date: Feb 2009
Posts: 1
I own a saturn

I own a Saturn raft.
Cons: My thwarts are not detachable.
The straps sewn into the floor scare me. I instruct passengers to stay the h3!! away from them.
Pros: The price

Rivers with the raft:
-Cataract Canyon (low water 3-0
-Dolores River (before memorial day weekend 0
If I can persuade my buddy's semi-pretentious, “It's not a brand I've ever heard of” attitude I aim to take it on the Grand this year.
-Oh yes, the raft has also been down The North Platte (this river is awful and hardly ever worth your trip up here).
Of course the wind blows a little stronger up here in Wywhere. I'm certain that psychological datum show that wind battering takes its toll. That being said, I feel absolutely no remorse whatsoever in the Saturn raft I purchased. I would really hate to become some poster child for a sales rep. I do enjoy my Saturn.
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Old 02-24-2009   #30
boise, Idaho
Paddling Since: 99
Join Date: Feb 2009
Posts: 50
From the horses

Originally Posted by shappattack View Post
That is some complex 3-way and I am thinking anyone on the fence about buying one of these is thinking WTF - I'll look some place else, can you post an org-chart. That is why I baught a cosmetic blem Aire. The warranty is straight forward, you buy an Aire from anyone, even a private party, and the warranty is the same (10 year no fault), anything goes wrong, and Aire (not the dealer) practically bends over backward to make it right. Worth some extra money, plus made in the U.S.A., good to keeps some jobs around here in these economic times.

It sure would be nice if the Boise guy chimed in, he never did respond the last time this warranty issuce came up on the buzz.
Hi All. My name is Cody and I handle most of the SATURN whitewater raft sales in the U.S. We have sold boats all over the country and even accross the borders to the north and south. Sorry we haven't replied to this site before but I wasn't aware of this discussion until one of my customers called me to let me know some questions needed to be resolved.

1st things 1st - We sell a hell of a whitewater raft. That said, I'm not putting us on par with AVON and never have. I love some of our competitors boats and never trash anyone else's product line. Love the Maravia urethane coating and wish we could do that to our rafts, but we just simply don't have the technology to do it at this point. We sell 100-200 rafts a year and amongst all of the distributors there are probably 300+ hitting the water EVERY season.

Back to the "hell of a whitewater raft comment"....our products workmanship is on par with everybody else. Our manufacturer is producing hundreds of inflatable boats every month. They are experts and put together a great product. Our rafts aren't beginner rafts like some claim, we've got commercial guides and outfitters putting thousands of miles per year on our rafts and the comments are always "best bang for the buck we've gotten out of a whitewater raft". Our costs are low because we basically have near 0 overhead in the U.S. since everything is produced in Korea and China.

Anyway, I'd love to hear back from the posters that started this post because that was 2 years ago and I'm sure they've put hundreds of miles on them. Our warranty is superb...we break it we buy it. As for the one CANYON raft claim up above, there is more to the story although in general it's true. The claim we got didn't list damage when the raft arrived. The damage was listed as happening after 1 season and the customer said there was an issue with the floor sticking so they continued to inflate it to try to get the part inflated. Anyway, the CANYON series rafts currently have I-beam floors and if you've been around long enough you know that I-beam floors can't be extremely overinflated or you are going to have big problems if you damage an I-beam. The manufacturer wouldn't accept the warranty claim because of the way it was described. That said, I have promised the customer a new raft at way below our cost and definitely want to make it right.

So, 1 unresolved warranty claim in the 300 rafts sold for the year? Come on, that's not too bad. And we'll make it right. Don't let that 1 issue change your mind about looking at our products. The distributor in Colorado bought a raft from us a couple of years ago and like everyone else was "so impressed" that he became a distributor.

Small sales pitch - Take a look at what we have to offer. Our rafts are built to sustain thousands of miles on the river. Our workmanship is excellent and warranty is great. We warranty about 1 raft per year other than replacing a few valves due to crimped gaskets during shipping.

AND FINALLY - We've heard our customers feedback and have continued to improve our models yearly. If enough of you want it, we'll do it. Check out our new 2009 models by visiting our website at . Or call us at (20 559-5449.

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