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Help with selecting IK

7K views 22 replies 17 participants last post by  twmartin 
#1 ·
Hi All,

K... I'm back with some questions about IK's. I'm looking to purchase this year, and really could use a little advice as the options seem fairly large. Budget is no so much a concern for me as value. I don't mind spending a little more upfront for higher quality and greater durability.

I want to use these for several purposes, and I'm not sure if all my criteria will be met in one boat, but I'd rather purchase one style of boat if possible. I've read some good information on the forum here, and will try not to repeat questions that have already been answered in full.

I really like the Aire brand, and have heard great things about their Lynx and Outfitter models. I understand the Tomcat is a decent budget boat as well. Here's what I want to do though. Each of the questions contains what appears to me to be the limiting factor.

1) I want to be able to fit my family into two boats for day trips. Family consists of me with wife and two kids. Both really young (4 & 2) but will grow into the sport :) I want to be able for each parent to take a child in the IK with them, and possibly to fit a parent + both kids in the same IK for easy Class II float. Do I need a single or dual sized IK for that do you think?

2) I want to be able to take said IK on multiday trips with self support backpacking style gear. Can a multi day trip be packed out of a single?

3) I want to be able to run Class IV in the IK. Particularly, on low volume rivers with an emphasis on maneuverability. Can a dual be paddled with sufficient maneuverability, assuming decent Class IV skills?

4) I want to be able to hike in to trips that are not road accessible, so weight is also an issue. Is a dual ridiculously heavy, maybe a single is too heavy and I need a specialized BAKRaft or something?

Bottom line, I know that anything will work for the family stuff. Just need appropriate sizing. I also want to be able to use the same boat for a little more difficult trips and particularly with hiking in, I want to minimize the wight. I'm leaning towards a single, but don't know if that will have enough room for overnights as well. Feedback is really appreciated!
 
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#2 ·
1) I want to be able to fit my family into two boats for day trips. Family consists of me with wife and two kids. Both really young (4 & 2) but will grow into the sport :) I want to be able for each parent to take a child in the IK with them, and possibly to fit a parent + both kids in the same IK for easy Class II float. Do I need a single or dual sized IK for that do you think?
Singles will work for a little while, but sooner than you can believe, your kids will be too big to fit in a single IK with you. Then they will want to take it by themselves.

2) I want to be able to take said IK on multiday trips with self support backpacking style gear. Can a multi day trip be packed out of a single?
Yes if you are a backpacker. No if you have been a rafter for very long. Your minimal float trip gear expands proportionally to the number of years you have been rafting.

3) I want to be able to run Class IV in the IK. Particularly, on low volume rivers with an emphasis on maneuverability. Can a dual be paddled with sufficient maneuverability, assuming decent Class IV skills?
Yes sufficient, although a double will take much more skill and will not be able to make all of the cuts.

4) I want to be able to hike in to trips that are not road accessible, so weight is also an issue. Is a dual ridiculously heavy, maybe a single is too heavy and I need a specialized BAKRaft or something?
Depends on how tough you are.

I would get a double and a single so that you have options.
 
#3 ·
I know that you mentioned a preference for AIRE products, but a friend of mine paddles the Hyside Padillac and it is the bees knees... And tough as nails to boot. If you could get a 2 person (12.0) https://hyside.com/product/padillac-ii-12-0/ and the alpacka alpackalypse Alpackalypse - Alpacka Raft LLC then you would be set for a couple of years...until you buy another double when the kids are bigger...

just my $.02

I love my alpacka--I have the llama with the spray skirt, but haven't taken it past class 3.
 
#4 ·
My issue with the Alpacka Raft is that while it is an interesting design. I don't see how I'm to fit gear for an overnighter in that. Hence the BAKRaft, or similair idea.

The idea of a single and a dual is a good one. Tough on packing in if its just my wife and myself with no kids.

For those with experience: How easy is it to do an over night trip with a single IK for each person? How much cargo capacity?
 
#5 ·
For the trips with you and the family on day trip stuff, and the overnight trips Two tomcat tandems seem like the ticket.. They are not really expensive they are stable for the kids and they have a large payload for the extended trips. this will also help when the kids get bigger. Being cheaper you could possibly do the two tandem tomcats and then add a solo boat for your class four technical rivers and hike in trips.
 
#6 ·
I'm thinking NRS MaverIK. One Mav 1 performance and a mav 2 in the quiver will do nicely. The hyplon makes the perform lite enough and supple to roll tight and pack well. The Mav would do an adult and small child in class 2. The mav 2 would give you the bigger boat. As your kids get older you would need to add to the quiver.
 
#7 ·
I think what you want is the Aire Bakraft 'Expedition', coming out this spring. It will be a little longer than their current bakraft. I'm a long time rafter/kayaker with about zero experience with IK's but I'm jumping on the packraft train. They will always be a compromise but if you have any desire to hike it in anywhere that's the way to go. Like I said I have no direct IK experience but with over 20 years of river experience and a lot of research I'm sold on the Aire Expedition. Longer water line will be a little faster and more stable, the only true self bailer with an inflated floor. Long enough to carry more gear or another person if needed. I can't wait for summer!
 
#8 ·
There's enough room behind you in a single to carry the pump and a 50 Liter or so drybag, which is about the same as a huge backpacking pack, but since you need dry clothes and shoes in there too it is just about right. The weight can throw the balance off so you may need to move the seat forward if running stouter whitewater.
My boat is about 35# and I've carried it up to a mile with no problem, even on rough terrain, by carrying in front, one shoulder then the other, hanging over the shoulders on the back, etc. Changing it up. I could have kept going further.
A Cinder Block is about 35#, so carry one of those for a while to get an idea. Of course, carrying the boat, paddle, and an overnight bag would be more annoying. Maybe a lightweight 50 Liter pack with the drybag inside to carry, then stuff the pack in the drybag to go in the boat.
 
#9 ·
I used to guide on the Gauley for a lot of years. In the summer at low water we run upper Gauley duckie trips from lost paddle to mason branch. All the guides are in NRS maverIK double ducks with a full loaded cooler strapped in the back, and customers are in aire linxs with a thwart instead of that silly seat, and a set of thigh straps. Both hold up to a ton of abuse and handle well as well as rolling up in a small package. I've seen the Aires go through hell and back and are lots of fun for a single person in hard whitewater. The nrs boats are stable, durable, and roll up well. There not cheap but they do seem to take a beating and handle well in my opinion.
Get one of each for best of both worlds. Just my .02
 
#10 ·
I would encourage you
To look at RMR boats and focus on doubles as others have said. IMHO RmR is more boat for similar money ... yes I am biased. Every boat out there will be a great choice but I believe that the RMR is the perfect blend of
Quality and customer service at an unbeatable price point.
 
#11 ·
Used to guide Ducky trips out of an NRS Maverick, and it was a great boat. Foot pegs and thigh straps make a HUGE diferance with boat control.
My Girl friend paddles a 2 person NRS and is able to pack basically her share of the gear for small boat over nights, it's pretty impressive how much she puts in her" gear Ducky".
She does wish she had the Hypalon version instead of the Urethane, as it has several pinhole leaks after a few years.
 
#12 ·
Tremendous feedback. Thanks to all. I think that the idea of a single and a double is gaining traction with me. Sounds like the single would give a slightly larger than typical backpacking payload. The double would clearly allow for some more luxury. But at a cost of weight and performance when paddled singly.

The long term view clearly has both kids in the duckies. Which is why I'm trying to get this kind of feedback. I'd rather think twice and buy once if possible. Thanks again guys... I appreciate the thoughts!
 
#15 ·
Thanks for the suggestions. I can't really see the mini-me working for all the criteria I would like to meet. 52lbs of rubber is quite a bit to start packing in. Nor will it meet the performance criteria for an R1 trip.

Still, I've never paddled one before and they do look like fun!
 
#16 ·
you could be like me. I have 6 IK's because I have a wife an 4 kids.. but also because I started with IK's and we all loved the sport so much, I also own a 16' Cat and a 14' raft. - just buy what you think would be fun. smaller kids will fit just fine in a single for a little while. but once they hit the 3rd or 4th grade.. They'll kick you out of the boat and take it for themselves. (this is why I have 6 IK's now) I'm personally not a fan of the tandem IK's they handle too much like a barge in my opinion.
 
#17 ·
Yes, I can see four duckies in my future :) but for now, 1 or 2 will do. Already have a SDP with frame, as well as a Aire 156E that belongs to my father in law, but lives in my garage. I've been able to use it pretty much at will for longer multi day trips. So I'm well set on the raft front. Just keeping an eye on the future, knowing how those kids will want to be paddling their own boats sooner rather than later.

You can tell my leaning toward Aire no doubt.
 
#18 ·
I'll throw my vote in for the One single One double idea. Mom & the 2 yr old in the single, you and the 4 yr. old in the double on day trips. You'd have the single for your low water/creeker/hike-in stuff, and the double for your multi-day stuff.

I've started flat water, multi-day touring in a 13 foot SOT hard shell kayak the past 2 years. With the right gear, it's like luxury backpacking with a Really Big backpack that floats. I've seen lots of folks on the Main & MF Salmon self supporting in double ducks. You just have to carry more conservative gear. For me it was an excuse to buy new gear!
 
#19 ·
I will throw my vote in for the alpaca packrafts if you will be doing mostly pack in trips. I know quite a few people with them, and they use them for everything from class IV day trips to self support grand canyon in 12 day trips. The alpacas have a zipper in the outer layer and 2 dry bags that clip inside and allow you to fill the inside of the inflatable chamber with your gear, letting them to haul quite a bit of gear. The zipper also makes repairs very easy. I have a nrs bandit and I love it, but I am envious of the alpacas anytime a hike is involved. The maverick is also an excellent boat.
 
#20 ·
IK Options

UriahJones,

Congrats on wanting to get the whole family out on the water! There has been a lot of good suggestions on the thread. I just wanted to throw out a couple more option coming your way from AIRE:

1) Tributary Spud, youth sized IK - We are getting our first batch of Spuds in this Wednesday! The Spud is $399, 7' long, and 21.5 lbs. It's a stable little kayak and a great way to introduce kids to paddling their own boat. Though not as light as a Packraft, at 21.5 lbs., you could still pack this boat and paddle it on some of the other expeditions you had in mind. (The adults here at AIRE had a blast surfing the Spud prototype.) I just posted the Spud page, you can read all about the Spud here: Spud Inflatable Kayak | AIRE Tributary

2) BAKraft Expedition - eddie mentioned the Expedition, so I thought I would add some details. We are currently manufacturing our first batch of Expedition inventory and they should be ready by the 2nd week of January. It's 10' long, 10 lbs, and $1999. It's not a true, 2 person boat, but you can definitely fit an adult and small child in the Expedition. Our BAKrafts are a little different then other packrafts, they ride and pack gear more like a traditional IK. They are made with ultra light fabric, and as with all backpacking gear, they require a little more TLC then our standard PVC IKs.

You said you would rather puchase one sytle boat if possible. I think any solo IK around 10' long, you should be able to fit 1 adult and 1 small child. All in all, I don't think you can go wrong with 2 solos, and for extra fun, 1 Spud!

Cheers,
Sheena Coles
AIRE Marketing
 
#21 ·
Thanks Sheena. Always appreciate the info. The Spud looks like a really cool idea. I'm glad to see you guys coming out with a product for the kids in the 'tweener stage; wanting to paddle alone, but not quite large enough to handle the bigger boat.

I will be keeping an eye on that option in the future. Currently the kids are a little young to be on their own. Maybe in a couple years the oldest will be ready. For the more immediate usage, I think that a standard sized IK will fit the bill.

The BAKRaft Expedition is intriguing. Basically a full sized version of the current Hybrid as I understand it. The concern which I am weighing with that option is whether it will be durable enough. I know that all ultra-light rafts struggle in this area... at least in comparison to their more rugged counterparts.

I'm getting close to making a decision, and I'm still leaning toward a single and dual IK. Either a Tributary Tomcat, or Lynx Series I think. I think a dual will be wanted to meet the adult + 2 kids, and longer IK multi-days criteria. The single will be perfect for adult + 1 kid, and easier to pack for shorter multi-days.

Great feedback from all. I really appreciate the help thinking this through!
 
#22 ·
You're sorta heading in two different directions here... You want a boat that can carry multiple people or camping gear, for which you will want a larger boat, but you also want something maneuverable and small to carry, which means a small boat.

For what it is worth, I have both an Aire Outfitter I and a Aire Lynx II, and the Lynx II isn't that much bigger or harder to carry once it is all rolled up. I've taken it down some easy class IV stuff, but the Outfitter is definitely much more maneuverable. It can carry a lot of stuff and or another person no problem. The Outfitter is awesome for whitewater, Class IV is no problem but there isn't a whole lot of extra space. You could take the two year old, but the four year old will probably be too big within a year or so.
 
#23 ·
I like the NRS Maverick and would suggest that you get a single and a double.

I have owned 2 Single NRS Mavericks for almost 10 years and love them. I bought them from a shop that was closing and they were rental inventory. They each have a patch or two on them. I would not recommend them for multi day trips. For that I would get a double.

They also have very little buoyancy in the bow, therefore it is difficult to load a heavy gear bag in the front. For a center seat set up in a double you will need a removable seat. I would also suggest foot pegs at the very least and thigh straps for each seat station.

I weigh over 250 and find that I am not an ideal weight for a single seater, but most of the friends and kids who paddle them love them.
 
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