looking for 4 spots on grand canyon permit 1,2,3 July 2017 - Mountain Buzz
 

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Old 10-12-2016   #1
 
hawthorn east, australia
Paddling Since: 1987
Join Date: Oct 2016
Posts: 2
looking for 4 spots on grand canyon permit 1,2,3 July 2017

G'day
My name is Theo Kossart and I am the trip leader of a small size Grand Canyon permit launch on the 2nd of July. We are 2 families of 4 from Australia and are experienced boaters.
We have another family of 4 that would like to join us.
I am looking for a standard size permit holder for the 1, 2 or 3 July that has 4 spots available on their permit. The family of 4 would nominally be on your permit but would be independent of your group. They would join up with us on the river.
If you can help us out that would be great.
Regards
Theo Kossart
tknp@iprimus.com.au

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Old 10-12-2016   #2
 
Electric-Mayhem's Avatar
 
Lakewood, Colorado
Paddling Since: 1993
Join Date: Jan 2004
Posts: 453
I don't think it works that way.

People on the same permit have to stay with their group and camp at the same camps. You could potentially try to find a standard size group that is willing to share camps each day I suppose but I suspect its a long shot with only one other private trip launching each day.

You never know though... maybe ask on the Grand Canyon Private Boaters Association page... Forums | Grand Canyon Private Boaters Association
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Old 10-13-2016   #3
 
St. George, Utah
Paddling Since: 1974
Join Date: May 2011
Posts: 22
The NPS Grand Canyon regulations state that no time can you have more than the number of people on your permit on the river at the same time.
The small size trips were added to "fit in" trips during the summer months with the hope that they would use smaller camps and not impact the larger private and commercial trips.

See below from the regulations:

H. Trip Size. Noncommercial river trips shall carry no more than 16 persons for a standard group or 8 persons for a small group at any point within the trip (total includes the Trip Leader/permittee and all passengers). People traveling under one permit must travel and camp together and occupy only one beach. It is permissible to split up the trip for the purpose of a loop hike, however, the trip must rejoin and camp together. Trips may not separate for the purpose of securing campsites ahead of other groups.
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Old 10-13-2016   #4
 
caverdan's Avatar
 
C. Springs, Colorado
Join Date: Aug 2004
Posts: 1,459
I don't think they will even allow you to trade permits with a large group. More than likely....your stuck with the group size you've got. Best to contact them directly and see if you can work something out.
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Old 10-13-2016   #5
 
bighorn1478@msn.com's Avatar
 
lafayette, Colorado
Paddling Since: 1961
Join Date: May 2010
Posts: 511
If you all were caught by a ranger doing that, you all would be up to your eye balls in kangaroo dung.
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Time is like a river. You cannot touch the water twice, because the flow that has passed will never pass again. Enjoy every moment of life on or off the river.
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Old 10-13-2016   #6
 
Join Date: Aug 2006
Posts: 206
I could be totally wrong.... but my bet is this becomes a cancellation or an unused permit. Next they will be looking for a 'guide'. Keep your heads up!
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Old 10-13-2016   #7
 
Denver, Colorado
Paddling Since: 1999
Join Date: May 2013
Posts: 37
If you keep the children in their pouches at all times do they count towards the group count?
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Old 10-14-2016   #8
 
hawthorn east, australia
Paddling Since: 1987
Join Date: Oct 2016
Posts: 2
thanks for all the replies... but geez I think I opened a can of worms.... guess I have learnt a bit about the finer points of where regulation meets boating
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Old 10-14-2016   #9
 
bighorn1478@msn.com's Avatar
 
lafayette, Colorado
Paddling Since: 1961
Join Date: May 2010
Posts: 511
Have a great 8 person trip, I wish I was one of the lucky 8
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Time is like a river. You cannot touch the water twice, because the flow that has passed will never pass again. Enjoy every moment of life on or off the river.
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Old 10-14-2016   #10
 
UriahJones's Avatar
 
Salem, Oregon
Paddling Since: 2005
Join Date: Aug 2015
Posts: 77
Yes, the forum is pretty consistently going to let you know in a hurry when you ask for people to break the regulations for float permits. In general it is best to take the time to actually read the regulations regarding the trips you intend to float, and then abide by them.

I think that you will find little sympathy or help from others if you fail that basic first step. If you are not the trip leader, I understand.

With that negative stuff out of the way, have a great trip! I just wish that I was on that trip this next year!
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