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Old 04-01-2015   #1
Vancouver Isl, BC
Paddling Since: 2008
Join Date: Aug 2009
Posts: 16
Experienced kayaker wants to purchase raft

Hi all.

I am an experienced kayaker and I am looking to purchase a raft. The first reason being would be to take friends (4 maybe 6) out on a local class 2/3 run. The second would be to have a platform to do some multi-day river trips in the PNW.

My rafting experience is limited, but I have done trips on the Lower Salmon and various day trips in other places.

I am looking for a destination to head to in early May. I am based in Vancouver and would be willing to travel for this - maybe around 15 hours drive max. The trip length is flexible but somewhere from 3-7 days would be ideal. I would be traveling with just one car, so some option of a shuttle would probably help! Any suggestions welcomed. I understand the Lower Salmon maybe too high? What is the Rogue River like? - How hard are permits to obtain?

The second challenge is to purchase a raft and appropriate gear! The budget and timeframe are fairly limited. I am looking to spend around $1500, then expand the setup over the next few years, but have something suitable to go with for now on a multi day. I know full well you get what you pay for (mostly) but how would something like this work for me - 12 ft whitewater river raft with self bailing and high pressure airmat

I know this is a small raft, but it would just be myself and one other on the multi day. Maybe taking more people out on day trips without a frame/gear.

I would likely then outfit this with an NRS Frame, Seat and Oars. Would I be crazy to take a raft on the multi day run without oars/rig and just use paddles, allowing an extra day or two? Saving some $ for later!

Would be great to hear any thoughts or suggestions - also keen to hear anyone who has any used gear/ frame for sale in the area.

Thanks for any help,

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Old 04-01-2015   #2
dafewillis's Avatar
Wheat Ridge, Colorado
Paddling Since: 2012
Join Date: Jun 2014
Posts: 143
You're gonna get "strongly encouraged" on here to steer clear of budget boats like aquamarines. I generally agree. Buy a solid brand used, and run options by the buzzards - these folks know so much about rafts it's crazy.

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Old 04-02-2015   #3
Portland, Oregon
Join Date: Mar 2015
Posts: 148
I am by no means an expert but here is my $0.02.

- If $1,500 is your budget I think you are going to need to look for a fairly old used boat with frame and oars already; if you are thinking multi-day with one person you either do some nutty R2 set-up or are rowing with a passenger. At that price point, not a lot to be had unless you find a golden-oldie. Other option is to rent.
- As far as Rivers, I don't know if the Rogue is a great idea for a newbie rafter. There are really only 3 trouble spots (Rainie Falls, Mule Creek and Blossom Bar). Rainie is easy to get around as long as you know where you are going, Mule Creek is not terribly difficult but would be a crap swim and that leaves you with Blossom. If flows are high (5-6K+ I'd guess) it is just a fun read and run rapid, if not, there is one or two moves to make with consequences if you don't. I have been fortunate enough to miss the move and ALLOWED a very long swim. Don't get me wrong, the Rogue is amazing but not exactly where I would go my first trip out.
- I would say the Lower Deschutes is a good bet or perhaps the Grand Ronde. 7 days is a lot to ask but you can get three to five days easy if you don't mind lots of time in camp. Other option would be to float all of Lower Deschutes, you would need to make a shuttle mid trip though as their is some unnavigable water in the middle. I will be making my first trip to Idaho this year for a multi-day so others will have to speak to those.
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Old 04-02-2015   #4
pocatello, Idaho
Paddling Since: 1991
Join Date: Feb 2010
Posts: 471
Rent for multi day trips. The odds of finding a boat worthy of an Idaho multiday in your price range is very slim. People always forget how expensive the little things are. Straps, nets, coolers, dryboxes, kitchen, pumps, oars, blades, repair kit, groover.....
Unless you land in a crew that lets you tag along with just personal gear renting is a superior option.
Yes, some of this stuff can be rigged for free/cheap. but it would suck to travel to ID with a ghetto rig and fight your equipment the whole time, or to lose some of it due to inadequate strappage or calamity.

Where I work we rent multi day rigs ready to go roughly $400 for a 5 day trip. You still have to cobble toghether a kitchen though. Come to our shop and dial in your rig with help or have us do it for you. I'm on the wrong side if Idaho for you but the prices are pretty comparable to what you should pay in Boise etc. You might even find that driving that far without a rig pay for a good portion of the rental.

Find a good used boat for local paddleboating. Possibly consider a bucket boat if you are sticking to class III and budget is a real concern. Again people forget the cost of paddles and a PFD for each person. a $1000 boat is going to run you $1500 to actually get out there fully equipped with new accessories.

The ad you posted is pretty typical of the cheaper glued PVC boats now widely available. The internal chicken line looks very dodgy. The tube diameter looks smallish. If the thwart diameter is 13" and the tubes roughly match 6 people will sink that ship. The bail holes look woefully inadequate and attaching that style of floor to the 'bucket' floor has proven to be a challenge to most/all mfg using this design. I have gone through a couple of them. I should know.

On a lower salmon trip about 7 years ago I came across a group with similar boats, PVC frames, hodge podge oars generally questionable equipment. They were beached above snow hole patching floors, taping frames, looking for more rope and generally looking scared to death of losing all their stuff in a very straighforward rapid. We gave them some parts to get through the rapid/trip. They did not flip but if they had I can't imagine those frames holding in a cooler or those coolers holding out any water. At that moment they did not look like they were having fun.
BUT BUT BUT they were on the river and probably enjoyed the bulk of the trip a great deal.

Idaho worthy boat rental prices from the website:
This package is for the boater with some experience. It takes knowledge and some skill to equip a raft like this for an overnight backcountry adventure. If this is what you're looking for then we have what you need. This Package will get you the following: raft, frame, 3 oars, 3 PFDs, 8 straps, a drop bag, a cooler, a repair kit, a pump, a throw bag, and a bow line. We also offer other gear that you may want for your trip check down in accessories.

The Row Package 1 Day 23 Days 4+ Days
10.5' Self-Bailing $55 $55/day $50/day
14' Self-Bailing $70 $70/day $65/day
15' Self-Bailing $70 $70/day $65/day
16' Self-Bailing $75 $75/day $70/day

Accessories 1 Day 23 Days 4+ Days
PFDs $2.50 $2/day $2/day
Wet Suits $10 $7/day $5/day
Booties $3 $2/day $2/day
Splash Suit $7 $5/day $4/day
Groover $12 $9/day $7/day
Dry Box $6 $5/day $4/day
Cooler $6 $5/day $4/day
Paddle $1 $1/day $0.50/day
Oar $4 $3/day $2/day
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Old 04-02-2015   #5
pocatello, Idaho
Paddling Since: 1991
Join Date: Feb 2010
Posts: 471
And let me add: I have seen a number of groups over the years on multi day trip in just paddle rigs. Maybe 4 guys in a 14' raft with backpacking gear in drybags. This is a totally legit way to get it done and by FAR the cheapest.
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Old 04-17-2015   #6
Vancouver Isl, BC
Paddling Since: 2008
Join Date: Aug 2009
Posts: 16
Many thanks for all of the responses.

Could somebody please advise their thoughts on this - price / suitability

Avon Whitewater Raft - Drifter
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Old 04-17-2015   #7
Osprey's Avatar
Join Date: May 2006
Posts: 683
That guy must not know what he's selling. I'd snatch that up assuming the rubber doesn't need any major repairs. It looks like it wasn't even used.

Sent from my Nexus 5 using Mountain Buzz mobile app
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Old 04-17-2015   #8
rivh2o's Avatar
p.c., confused
Paddling Since: 1978
Join Date: Jan 2013
Posts: 139
I think that is a pretty good deal and a great starter. I'd jump on it. Get a five gallon bucket thrown in for bailing and get on the riv. Hippity Ho!
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Old 04-17-2015   #9
Dipshit with the most.
carvedog's Avatar
Bellevue, Idaho
Paddling Since: 1991
Join Date: May 2005
Posts: 2,496
Originally Posted by harrywatson View Post
Many thanks for all of the responses.

Could somebody please advise their thoughts on this - price / suitability

Avon Whitewater Raft - Drifter
The dry box isn't really a dry box but that looks like just what you are looking for. Not good for huge water but a small bucket boat like that can be a lot of fun.

As flya mentioned you are far from done. Pump, repair kit, straps and other gear will add. Firepan on most rivers, toilet etc.
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Old 04-17-2015   #10
codycleve's Avatar
salmon, Idaho
Paddling Since: 2004
Join Date: Mar 2012
Posts: 639
I would jump on that deal.. If it wasn't so far I would.. And I dont even really need it.

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