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Old 03-17-2014   #51
lmyers's Avatar
Buena Vista, Colorado
Paddling Since: 2005
Join Date: Jun 2008
Posts: 4,207
I have sent 4 emails to our private boater reps since January asking how the January meeting went and when they scheduled the next one for....but have not got a response. This is the issue I have with the way the CTF works. Every meeting is supposed to be open to the public with a public comment period, but all possible attempts are made to limit public knowledge of the meetings and what is discussed at the meetings.

I would like to know the stance our reps have on the current situation of water releases, as well as know how we were represented during the chapter 2 review and revisions to the Management Plan. I should not have to attend every meeting to obtain this information.

GARNA’s mission is to foster stewardship of the resources of the greater Arkansas River region through education, volunteerism and experiences.
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Old 03-17-2014   #52
Salida, Colorado
Paddling Since: 1986
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 727
Originally Posted by lmyers View Post
Absolutely Jahv. I kinda went off on Fred when he brought this up a couple meetings ago... I brought it up to Earl and he pointed out that CKS sends beginners up to run Kobe to Granite at high water. Hopefully he got his email out to Leslie and Mark... Every inch of the Ark should be open to any legal form of private recreation desired.
I have put on at the reservoir upstream of Kobe as well, that is an awesome early spring run to Granite. I agree 100% that it should remain open for that use. The boatable season up there is short, and its high water anyway, there are not droves of fly fishermen there during that time frame.

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Old 03-18-2014   #53
poncha springs, Colorado
Join Date: Aug 2009
Posts: 15
i'm thinking that if you're entertaining this idea that we can prevent boating permits or a lottery on the Arkansas. you're delusional.
it's all about money!
browns canyon wilderness = mo' money
permits for boaters = mo' money
gold medal fishery = mo' money
Christo draperies = mo' money
what good is this river to anyone if we can't make money off it? and in order for the river to meet it's maximum potential it must be "improved" upon with more boat ramps, more facilities, and more groomed campgrounds, more designations, like wilderness and gold medal. so that your average citiot will know exactly where they need to take their wallets to pay to experience those types of things.
if you build it they will come and they will pay to have the experience and we will all be happier for it. especially those of us who are lucky enough to have a river like this in our backyard, because we will all have more money in our pockets. everyone knows this equation. money = happiness
so let's form a committee to put together a task force, to report our findings to the BLAH BLAH BLAH.
and that's all I have to say about that. and if I haven't personally offended you with my rant....I apologize
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Old 03-18-2014   #54
denver, Colorado
Join Date: Nov 2013
Posts: 139
Is this stupid Christo thing actually going to happen? Like for real? I can't believe anyone would think this is ok.
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Old 04-04-2014   #55
Denver, Colorado
Paddling Since: 1998
Join Date: May 2009
Posts: 24
Latest and Greatest....

A quick, update. I'm trying to keep things brief...if you want more information, please send me an email.

When you see these comments in the meeting notes, please remember you are seeing discussion on a topic. It doesn't mean it will be policy. Each member of the CTF gets to add their thoughts to the discussion and a redlined copy of the current Management Plan. If it is supported by other members of the CTF, their names get added. If not, that rep gets to stand alone. After we finish this, AHRA will review these comments and take our recommendations under consideration when they write the new Management Plan. Then, there will be a period for public comment.

There is a list of other groups around the state that should have input into the CTF nomination process. I would suggest those groups that are interested speak up so we know you are interested. Send an email to me (or Mark) or AHRA so we can say, "Yep, I've gotten input from them."

Some clarification on Section 1. It was requested by the fishermen that boating be eliminated above Kobe. We are looking at flows to determine a boating season (when fishermen wouldn't be there anyhow) and look into it more. Note: The request can be made but AHRA gets the final call. Doesn't mean it will be policy...see above.

Nothing changed in Numbers all the way to Section 3. No increase or decrease in bpd (boats per day) on Numbers or Browns. The counts for the last few years have been lower than the threshold. There was a comment from the environmental rep about lowering the counts on the higher runs where privates have 350 bpd. We aren't anywhere near that number but I'm not supporting anything that cuts back on our bpd on any part of the river unless other private boaters tell me otherwise.

Section 3. Many options came thing was to encourage river use within the towns that have play parks, etc. Section 3 could be divided into 3 parts (3a to Salida East, 3b to Rincon, 3c to V Bridge). Section 3a could then be attached to the play park (open access zone) and that, for the most part, would eliminate the whole permitting debacle. Each segment would have the same bpd. That season could possibly extend to August 15. (Each of these is a piece that could or could not happen.) Private boaters have made this request without the official support of the other reps...but all were very favorable.

When we get to the section on permitting, I'm sure we will be making the request to eliminate that process.

ACTION: My question to you....what do you think about increasing commercial bpd in the Royal Gorge? Any input...I'll try to check here, but please send me an email...or use the AHRA comment form.

Regarding the Voluntary Flow Program, if you have questions or comments about the flows, please let AHRA know via their Comment Form. People post here but unless they let AHRA know directly, it isn't on record. Currently, AHRA and AROA feel they represent the private boating interest in those discussions. If you feel that isn't the case, they need to hear from you directly.

Cristo...haven't heard anything lately about that one...

If you want minutes/summaries from the CTF meetings when the come out via email, let me know. I have exactly ONE person (yes, that's you Logan) on my list. Otherwise, I'll do my best to post here when I can (Mark, too, I'm sure)


Leslie, CTF Private Boater Rep AHRA,
What are you doing HERE!!! For crying out loud...GO BOAT!!
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Old 04-28-2014   #56
Niwot, Colorado
Paddling Since: 1975
Join Date: Apr 2008
Posts: 35
Thanks for the update leslie. Some important issues to weigh in on. Absolutrly No to forbidding boating on any section of the river. If it is too low flow then its too low. Dont need a prohibition on that.

I would not increase numbers in the Gorge nor try to direct use to oher sections. Absolutely no to permits. Perhaps wilderness camp reservations could work but if you want to blast Browns in the afternoon in a river runner you should be able to with no questions asked.

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Old 11-11-2014   #57
lmyers's Avatar
Buena Vista, Colorado
Paddling Since: 2005
Join Date: Jun 2008
Posts: 4,207
FYI-CTF meeting tomorrow in Poncha. Here is the info from the AHRA:

"Attached is the Agenda for our Next CTF Meeting this Wednesday, which will be held at the Chaffee County Fairgrounds in Poncha Springs. This will be a special meeting with 3 presentations from experts in their field: Erica Pilcher, National Park Service; Don Bruns, Bureau of Land Management; and Francisco Valenzuela, US Forest Service. I have attached a map to the Fairgrounds if you aren't sure where it is located.

See you Wednesday

Rose Bayless
Program Assistant
Arkansas Headwaters Recreation Area"
GARNA’s mission is to foster stewardship of the resources of the greater Arkansas River region through education, volunteerism and experiences.
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Old 07-05-2015   #58
Bismarck, North Dakota
Paddling Since: 2012
Join Date: Aug 2012
Posts: 207
I just read all 6 pages and the suspense is killing me¡ so what happened?
Remember what the door mouse said.......................feed your head.........feed your head ©®™
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Old 07-05-2015   #59
lmyers's Avatar
Buena Vista, Colorado
Paddling Since: 2005
Join Date: Jun 2008
Posts: 4,207
Nothing. The CTF is still completing the review process, but they are damn near done. A consultant will then be brought in to review their recommendations and help the managers develop several versions an updated draft plan.Then the public will get to review these options and weigh in with their opinions. These things generally take 3-5 years...
GARNA’s mission is to foster stewardship of the resources of the greater Arkansas River region through education, volunteerism and experiences.
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Old 07-07-2015   #60
Denver, Colorado
Paddling Since: 1998
Join Date: May 2009
Posts: 24
To add to Logan's response, there will be some scoping meetings in various cities around the state so stay tuned and attend one in your local area. We have been reviewing the old Management Plan for content and updating. The consultant needs to type the Management Plan into its new format before we can review the final document and present it for public comment. There are still topics under discussion. If you have any input now, please post here or let one of the reps know. Thanks. Leslie

What are you doing HERE!!! For crying out loud...GO BOAT!!
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