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Old 02-06-2009   #11
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Originally Posted by yarmonymatoid View Post
Here's a really good read on the topic... put's everything in real terms instead of perception.

Who Bears the Burden? Demographic Characteristics of U.S. Military Recruits Before and After 9/11
Normally I take anything from the Heritage Foundation with a huge grain of salt, but that was a well-researched and informative report. Changed some of my perceptions. Thanks for posting this.

I'd like to see some of the data past 2005, just as reference. I know that the military largely met or exceeded its recruiting goals the last couple of years, but the demographic detail would probably take a while to dig up.

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Old 02-06-2009   #12
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EF - Funny, I had the same reaction, almost a visceral reaction. When I saw "Heritage Foundation," my immediate thought was, "Yeah, Cheney's home-away-from-bunker." Then I saw the 1999 charts-n-graphs and thought, "right, better economic times, hardly representative." But I scrolled down and saw the 2005 content. Pretty thorough stuff. My question is this: What happens to the demographics given the current economic situation? I'm going to guess that we'll see growing numbers of lower-income folks entering the military. We'll see. Anyhow, thanks for the informative link, TT.

You can never step into the same river; for new waters are always flowing on to you. - Heraclitus of Ephesus
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Old 02-06-2009   #13
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Originally Posted by DurangoSteve View Post
Anyhow, thanks for the informative link, TT.
It was yarmony
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Old 02-06-2009   #14
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i doubt it steve, the lower income people are still low income. i don't see it changing there decisions but i do see more middle class joning for bene's when they are harder to find at the moment. if low income people were greatly effected by the offers of the army why didn't they join before the economy went sour because which they would have still been low income.
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Old 02-06-2009   #15
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Oh. Mea culpa. Thanks, Yarm.
You can never step into the same river; for new waters are always flowing on to you. - Heraclitus of Ephesus
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Old 02-06-2009   #16
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The second the draft comes back you'll all be welcome to come visit us in Costa Rica
"You're gonna be doin a lot of doobie rolling when youre LIVIN IN A VAN DOWN BY THE RIVER"
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Old 02-06-2009   #17
Down by the River, Idaho
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Geez.... It sure is nice to live in a bubble (such as Durango) and criticize. No guns, no conservatives, no military, no nothing that I don't agree with while I live in my little bubble. Wouldn't it all be so wonderful if we could all live in a place where we eat and drink our organic products, bike along the river trail, laugh at the police blotter, walk our dogs downtown for whatever activity is happening, live in over priced housing and go do our yoga on a Saturday morning?

The freedom to criticize our own country comes with a price. The military is a necessary component of our country. As soon as we lower our military resources the United States, World Police as we are, would have its ass kicked by people sick and tired of us interfering.

I've never been in the military but I am sure as hell grateful to those that have. I thank them all!

Seems to me... That Roosevelt said it best when he said, "walk softly and carry a big stick." Until we listen to that advice we need the military we have and then some. DS is correct in the fact that we don't need people that don't want to be there along side people that do. So until the world is a harmonious place... Or at least until we can expand our Durango bubble to encompass our entire country... We need a paid military to take care of our big nose that we keep sticking into others business.

Though, we could save a shit ton of money and get rid of some social programs and actually hold people accountable for their own lives. That would be an impressive feat! Getting people off the governments nipple and get them to stand on their own 2 feet. That would be amazing.....

Helio and Timber.... Nice posts by the way!
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Old 02-06-2009   #18
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Interesting thread. So many stereotypes being pulled down.
"Let us cross the river to the other side and rest beneath the shade of the trees." ~ Last words of Thomas Jonathan ''Stonewall' Jackson
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Old 02-06-2009   #19
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Theo - true story. Whatever we all may individually think about Demos' views, she does provoke thought and discussion. And that, I think we all can agree, is a good thing.

Now I need to juggle a newsletter, opinionating, and photographing a cool-as-hell bald eagle that is hanging around my house. A true multitasking challenge...
You can never step into the same river; for new waters are always flowing on to you. - Heraclitus of Ephesus
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Old 02-06-2009   #20
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Heliodorus wrote: But the second issue problematic to Iraq and Afghanistan is that the American public, and the American media in particular, have abrogated their responsibility to investigate, consider, and understand what 'the precious few' are being asked to do. We are a society surfeited on saturated fat, corn syrup, and sound-bite. As a culture, our hallmark is to be distracted from issues of substance toward flashy lights, from cradle to grave, to be amused to death.

If people cared, Demos, we wouldn't allow these things to happen.
The problem is not that our military is volunteer.
Our problem is that our society doesn't care.
F'ing brilliant post, Helio... f'ing brilliant. The quoted paragraph is about the best summation I have read in awhile!!

The military debate topic always makes me think of Eisenhower's farewell speech...

In the councils of government, we must guard against the acquisition of unwarranted influence, whether sought or unsought, by the military-industrial complex. The potential for the disastrous rise of misplaced power exists and will persist.
We must never let the weight of this combination endanger our liberties or democratic processes. We should take nothing for granted. Only an alert and knowledgeable citizenry can compel the proper meshing of the huge industrial and military machinery of defense with our peaceful methods and goals, so that security and liberty may prosper together.
Does anybody here agree with Eisenhower? Does anybody think the "disastrous rise of misplaced power" has already happened? It is also interesting to ponder that at least one of these same military corporations (GE) owns major media outlets too..

(An important side-note: Criticism of the MIC does not equate to criticism of the brave men and women serving in the military.)

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