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Old 12-04-2008   #21
caspermike's Avatar
Bozeman, Montana
Paddling Since: 1999
Join Date: Mar 2007
Posts: 5,507
Bad ass, just making sure.... you have a head on them shoulders unlike some others.....

the problem is somebodies land somehwere in the world will be drilled on because of international demand. if we do end up buying more that just makes the case why americans are greedy more of a fact. we can keep oil companies in check by depending less on foreign oil more on american oil. they would be forced to tighter environmental restrictions which in fact helps the environment more than having them somewhere hooked up to giant diesel motors. more environmentally friendly ways to drill like "direction". one hole many different angles of hitting pockets. the answer isn't to get rid of american drilling but make it environmentally friendly. we can make cars run more effeiecnt with the grades of gasoline we have today.

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Old 12-04-2008   #22
rwhyman's Avatar
Unincorporated Douglas County, Colorado
Paddling Since: 2005
Join Date: May 2005
Posts: 961
Wouldn't some of the greedy Americans be the greedy fucking oil companies that sell American oil to other counties, to the tune of 1.8 Billion barrels a day, because they can make more money.

David Sassoon: US Oil Exports Hit Record Pace. That's Right, Exports

Talk about fucking over Americans so the greedy bastards can line their pockets.

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Old 12-04-2008   #23
caspermike's Avatar
Bozeman, Montana
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Posts: 5,507
thats why laws should be made to ban export on oil? but who will do it?
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Old 12-04-2008   #24
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Grand Junction, Colorado
Paddling Since: 2005
Join Date: Sep 2005
Posts: 297
To respond before I'm accused of being a hypocrite, yes, I do use oil, and yes, that oil is absolutely vital to my way of life. That comes with growing up in the United States, where even if you live in a cave and kill all your food with your bare hands you benefit from the stability provided by a government and society that is based on an unlimited supply of incoming energy.

Now, our domestic oil consumption has increased from around 15.5 million barrels of oil a day in 1983 to just under 21 million barrels a day in 2007(U.S. Product Supplied for Crude Oil and Petroleum Products)

What this means is that we need more oil. Our population has increased and our per capita oil consumption has increased. Based on these data, it follows that as time passes we will need more oil in the future to maintain anything close to the standard of living we all enjoy today. Now, the supply of oil, worldwide, is finite. Infinitely expanding oil needs + finite oil = a nice big energy crash, and we all tear each other's thoats out around big wood-fueled bonfires.

No one wants this. It seems the logical, sane approach would be to slowly transfer ourselves to renewable sources of energy before a big scary crash forces us to.

Estimated oil reserves in Utah: 355 million barrels.(Energy Information Administration - State Energy Profiles energy data, information, and maps). If we continue to use 21 million barrels a day, 355 million/21 million = 16.9 days of oil.

Sorry for the book, but my argument is this: Is 17 fewer days of imported oil worth the impact drilling would bring to some of the most spectacular wild country in the world? Wouldn't it be just as effective in the long term if we figured out how to use non-oil, ideally renewable energy for as much of our energy needs as we could, and more efficiently use the oil that we will still need?

-Τὸ χόβερκράφτ μου εἶναι γεμᾶτο χέλια!
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Old 12-04-2008   #25
Chip's Avatar
SE, Wyoming
Paddling Since: 1986
Join Date: Apr 2007
Posts: 1,098
Originally Posted by caspermike View Post
right answer petroluem.

At least it ain't nucuelar.

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