Obama "Our Savior"

[DurangoSteve]

Too close to the end of the day/week for me to continue the Semantic Dance. And Kool-Aid with 151 isn't half bad...

Originally Posted by lhowemt

You're missing the point. I'm no cynic, and I don't expect others to agree with me. Reason number 600 I'm not a republican - group think requirement. Once you see the elephant, it is actually quite relieving and heartening.

You use the term cynical in a socially acceptable way where it is used to put down those that aren't drinking Kool-Aid! Cynicism (read a bit of history and philosophy) is actually pretty darn admirable. So I should take it as a compliment, except I know it's not intended as one, and I am not a historic, nor modern, cynic. Just a straight shooter.

You can't pretend that rock/hole/pourover isn't there, why do so many try to pretend other things in life aren't there? Doesn't boating help us strip down all of those constructs that we put up to protect ourselves and our so-dearly held beliefs? Those hazards in the river are real. So are the hazards of getting baited into dems -vs- repubs. Don't look now, they're printing more money to give to the investment firms who blew their investments all the while getting HUGE salaries! Pretty good deal for them. WE are all going to have to pay that money back.

[Proslackass]

Originally Posted by marko

This video clip just may be more than comedy. Or not. I guess it depends on how hard you hold onto your ideologies.

As for the speech...I'm gonna keep my opinions to myself on this one. Ive got too much homework to get into this debate.

I am going to keep my opioions to myself also, but that big red, white and blue dick in my ass is starting to hurt . That is fucking hilarious!! RIP George...

[lhowemt]

Originally Posted by DurangoSteve

Too close to the end of the day/week for me to continue the Semantic Dance. And Kool-Aid with 151 isn't half bad...

Reading material for this weekend if you are interested. A good explanation of what I call the "dishrag syndrome".

What's Missing From the Democratic Convention? | CommonDreams.org

Excerpt follows:

As one would expect them to be, virtually all of the prime-time speeches at the Democratic Convention have been -- from a rhetorical perspective -- very well-crafted and well-delivered. Bill Clinton's speech, in particular, deserves all the plaudits it is receiving, both in terms of content and delivery. But as competent, well-executed and even dramatic as the Convention has been, at least as striking is what has been missing.


First, there is almost no mention of, let alone focus on, the sheer radicalism and extremism of the last eight years. During that time, our Government has systematically tortured people using sadistic techniques ordered by the White House; illegally and secretly spied on its own citizens; broken more laws than can be counted based on the twisted theory that the President has that power; asserted the authority to arrest and detain even U.S. citizens on U.S. soil and hold them for years without charges; abolished habeas corpus; created secret prisons in Eastern Europe and a black hole of lawlessness in Guantanamo; and explicitly abandoned and destroyed virtually every political value the U.S. has long claimed to embrace.



Other than a fleeting reference to such matters by John Kerry in a (surprisingly effective) speech which most networks did not broadcast, one would not know, listening to the Democratic Convention, that any of those things have happened. Even our unprovoked and indescribably destructive attack on Iraq, based on purely false pretenses, has received little attention. Those things simply don't exist, even as part of the itemized laundry list of Democratic grievances about the Bush administration. The overriding impression one has is that the only things really wrong during the last eight years in this country are that gas prices are high and not everyone has health insurance. Those are obviously very significant problems, but they are garden-variety political issues which don't begin to capture the extremism that has predominated in this country under GOP rule, and don't remotely approach conveying the crises on numerous fronts the country faces.

[TakemetotheRiver]

Where do I start? Here- this is so true and you always seemed so reasonable to me so far.

Originally Posted by lhowemt

You can't pretend that rock/hole/pourover isn't there, why do so many try to pretend other things in life aren't there? Doesn't boating help us strip down all of those constructs that we put up to protect ourselves and our so-dearly held beliefs? Those hazards in the river are real. So are the hazards of getting baited into dems -vs- repubs.

But this: Did they play the Hallelujah chorus in the background? This is hyperbole- a form of verbal irony closely related to sarcasm- hence the confusion.
Here's the link to Obama's speech:

YouTube - Part 1-Barack Obama DNC Acceptance Speech Denver August 28th, 2008Barack Obama at the Democratic National Convention 2008!

Watch it, then say it's a waste of time, empty rhetoric, etc.

I am a self-proclaimed cynic. I'm sarcastic and I believe that most people are selfish and insincere. My friends tell me I'm not because I still love everyone. We can be cynical and still see the good in others without compromising our ability to detect bullshit. Give Obama a chance, since McCain offers nothing new on which to build.

And Kool-Aid with 151 isn't half bad...- That's hilarious.

Remember that most of the people who drank the Kool-aid were forced at gunpoint, or coerced (the children). Most of our eyes, if not our minds, are open now, hopefully.

[riverrat]

Can we please leave my Kool-Aid out of it. It's an incredible drink that tastes great, is cheap, easy to pack and goes with pretty much any meal. Use whatever analogy you like, but leave my Kool-Aid out of your politics.

emt does make some good points. There are a lot of people out there who spout the whole "think for yourself" stuff. Just remember that saying you think for yourself doesn't mean you are doing it.

[Jensjustduckie]

This is awesome, you guys crack me up! Hasn't anybody learned that it doesn't matter what the election is about or who is running, it all boils down to one thing:

Are you voting for the Turd Sandwich or the Giant Douche? Either way it's disgusting!

[blutzski]

Originally Posted by lhowemt

Reading material for this weekend if you are interested. A good explanation of what I call the "dishrag syndrome".

What's Missing From the Democratic Convention? | CommonDreams.org

Excerpt follows:

Good article with the exception that it assumes the GOP has a monoply on f*#king over the citizens. The reason the Democrats don't want to call the Republicans on it is they pull the same shit. The politicians don't want to call our attention to any of that stuff because then the public might actually then start focusing on the real issues instead of "garden-variety political issues" such as gas prices and health care. The only one who brings those issues up is Ron Paul (a republican).

Here's another Excerpt from the article

The loudest reaction Bill Clinton provoked last night was when he proclaimed, in passing and without elaboration, that Obama is "ready to preserve, protect, and defend the Constitution of the United States." So much of the case against the Bush administration -- much of what has fueled high-level Democratic energy to remove the GOP from power -- has been driven by the GOP's radical transformation of the core political values of the country, trampling on the Constitution and overtly embracing policies that are completely anathema to how Americans perceived of their country.

I remember that part of Clintons speech and wanted to throw something at the TV when I heard it. If Obama wins the election he is going to be flat out lying when he takes the oath to preserve, protect, and defend the Constitution of the United States. So will McCain.

[cayo 2]

Blutski ,you forgot Dennis Kucinich,the media gave very little coverage to his speech addressing these issues among others.The reason the dems responded to Clinton's comment so vigorously,was not their views on the constitution,but rather that he was coming around to endorsing OBAMA and the operative word WAS 'READY' NOT CONSTITUTION,combating the ads reps were running quoting Hillary's assertion he wasn't ready in the primaries.It was about patching up differences not constitutional philosophy.I can understand why it pissed you offf from your point of view.


ihowemt,I think alot of people are very disillusioned with both parties,myself included,they both do some of the same things some of the time and are forced to play the same game as far financing elections.It is also true that the dems reluctance to truly challenge the status quo is in part due to their complicity.WHAT YOU ARE OVERLOOKING IS THE MATTER OF DEGREE AND iDEOLOGICAL DIFFERENCES.While O bama will not be able to implement anything radical even if he wanted to,he offers a more progressive approach to solving problems,he does outline specifics on his website ,the media ignores them[McCAIN also}.To say the dems are as bad as the reps under normal circumstances is debatable,to argue they are as bad as the CURRENT BATCH OF NEO CONS is absurd.Review the 'ARTICLES OF IMPEACHMENT' thread.


Ideologically,who would take away womens right to choose?Who wants cooperation with other countries and who are preemptive unilateralists?Who wants to perpetuate the petrocracy and who wants to fast track alternative energy?Who embraces science and who distorts it for political and economic gain?Who wants to improve infrastructure and who never wants to pay taxes for anything?Who celebrates diversity and who thinks America is a white christian country?Who wants to privatize everthing?Who wants regulatory oversite of the commmons and who wants a festival of greed??? on and on ad nauseum.


I would like to strangle these jackasses who use SOCIALISM as dirty word when they clearly have no concept of what it is,or the motives of those who espouse it,and who equate all things populist with their distorted misunderstanding of it.We don't even have a true left in this country,right wing propagandists have successfully moved the center waaay to the right of the center of the international range of political discourse.The sky will not fall if we have 'socialized medicine',and A SINGLE PAYER NON PROFIT HEALTH CARE SYSTEM ISN'T SOCIALISM ANYWAY.Next time you are debating taxes consider the tax no ever takes into account ,the tax the rich put on you to get access to the resources you need and that they have usurped,PROFIT.This is what Proudhon was talking about when he said " pROPERTY IS THEFT" not that you couldn't have belongings or modest land holdings.