Thread Tools Display Modes
Old 02-06-2009   #11
pnw, Washington
Join Date: Oct 2003
Posts: 3,404
Wonder if it makes any noise? Can it handle higher winds and not disintegrate?

"Yesterday I was clever and tried to change the world. Today I am wise and try to change myself." -Rumi
gh is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-06-2009   #12
Join Date: Aug 2004
Posts: 772
On the higher winds, if he modeled it off the Tacoma Narrows does it have to be in resonance to be efficient or can it be efficient with high or low wind speeds. There's a lot of questions that go with it but it would be interesting to see if that is the future of wind power.

Nathan is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 02-06-2009   #13
dgosn's Avatar
San Juans, Colorado
Paddling Since: 2001
Join Date: Sep 2006
Posts: 485
Originally Posted by DurangoSteve View Post
Nathan - good point about the transmission line issue. Nobody likes those things overhead (big hoohah in SoCal right now about them) in their backyard. What I don't understand is why we don't bury the transmission lines to eliminate the "unsightliness" aspect and help mitigate the magnetic field issue. Could be some technical reason I don't know of...

Underground transmission lines cost several times more to construct than overhead lines. This is due to cost to dig, jackhammer, and fill with specific materials.

Maintenance to underground lines is problematic. New fangled devices can actually pin point where a fault (damage) is with in a few YARDS! However you then have to dig it up.

Underground lines also have an issue with lifespan, they loose efficiency at a faster rate. Overhead lines can be installed quickly with bucket trucks, wire spoolers (giant winch) and many people. Underground collection, transmission, and distribution lines need excavators, gravel trucks, often pneumatic rock hammers mounted on enormous machines, loaders, dozers, etc... add in a couple more union boys and you get the picture

I have seen 10+ miles of transmission line be strung from a wind farm substation to the 'grid' in a matter of a couple weeks. I have seen the same amount of line take 2-3 months when buried.

Underground easements also come into play when you are near other utility lines, pipes, etc.... An overhead still has easement issues but you can drill a few 24" holes every few hundred feet as opposed to a 4 foot deep, 2 foot wide trench for miles and miles. The amount equipment needed to install underground collection and distrubution is more than one would think...

Sport Climbing is Neither
--The Verm
dgosn is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-06-2009   #14
DurangoSteve's Avatar
Durango, Colorado
Paddling Since: 2001
Join Date: Jun 2006
Posts: 1,907
Scott - good explanation. Not sure why the cost/complication aspect didn't occur to me. Several years ago LPEA agreed to relocate an overhead service line that ran to my neighbor's house. It was strung above where I wanted to build an addition and there wasn't enough clearance. "All" I had to do was dig a (really frickin' long) trench to their specs and bed it with lots of nice sand. I did... with seriously undersized equipment considering the gigantic boulders I dug up. It was a bitch.
You can never step into the same river; for new waters are always flowing on to you. - Heraclitus of Ephesus
DurangoSteve is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-07-2009   #15
Chip's Avatar
SE, Wyoming
Paddling Since: 1986
Join Date: Apr 2007
Posts: 1,098
Neat idea. The sound card on my computer's buggered, so I can't hear what he's saying— time to get it fixed.

Anyhow, based on eyeballing, it seems like the major problem with scaling up would be the vibrational stress and load at the ends of the ribbon.

I thought of something similar, that would draw a spring-loaded strip or rod in and out of a coil. While rotary blade-driven turbines work best with steady wind speeds, this design would generate power as the velocity changes.

It could also be used to generate power from river flow without diverting water. Not as much yield as a turbine, but not as much cost and river-ruination. either.

(I just clicked on the Johnson Controls advert, left. Some cool design games there.)
Chip is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-09-2009   #16
Denver, Colorado
Paddling Since: 1995
Join Date: Apr 2007
Posts: 2,239
yeah my sound's out too.On the river thing, I remember seeing where locals were converting car engines into turbines and placing them in rivers for personal energy generation during the break up of Yugoslavia/ethnic cleansing conflict.I was always curious about the environmental impact.Anyone know?

A little off topic but I once saw a really cool perpetual motion machine.It was actually a sculpture/mobile by Alexander Calder composed of cast iron and mercury.The thing was set in motion by pouring the mercury down a water[mercury] slide/ falls into a pool/receptacle at the bottom,the movement of the mercury from it's own inherent instability turned a small turbine that pumped the mercury through a straw back up to the top to restart the cycle.The momentum of a liquid going down a slope may have turned the turbine as well.Now if we only had a shitload of mercury,that wouldn't hurt the environment would it? The squiggly silver mercury cascading against a black background was very cool,the museum Fundacion Joan Miro in Barcelona kind of sucked overall,don't care for Miro.They had an exhibit in the basement of an African artist Cheri Samba that was a bunch of cartoon like caricatures of the first Bush and Saadam Hussien from a third world persons point of view,that was pretty good .He didn't seem to think much of either one of them,The ride up there is pretty odd too in some funicular /gondola type thing you felt like James Bond.
cayo 2 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-10-2009   #17
yakrafter's Avatar
Whitewater Boater, Boating Whitewater
Paddling Since: 2004
Join Date: Aug 2006
Posts: 147
If efficiency was high enough, the other issues could be worked out.

Love to see some real data at a few different scales, even small ones.

First glance Q - how many watts is he producing with his fan which uses 100's of watts?

Gotta start somewhere.

Worth noting in CO, as a wind power generator myself, that when I have enough wind I generally have more than enough. i.e. when the wind is blowing, batts can be topped off in no time, when it is not, solar feeds us.

I love the idea of micro wind, but day to day, you will likely still see solar panels on top of highway signs due to reliablity of daily power vs. great power some days and minimal most others.

Love it, keep it up.

P.S. we need to stop transmitting power over long distances anyway - above or below ground.

On average nationally, we only deliver 30% of the power that goes into the grid, even after the production efficiency. The rest is lost to resistance (actual warming and some sound). Pretty poor.

It would be great to advance these and other technologies or just plain put smaller power plants in more locations with less distribution, which also tends to double the cost of the power anyway.
yakrafter is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-11-2009   #18
ngeoym's Avatar
Bayfield, Colorado
Paddling Since: 2006
Join Date: Jun 2007
Posts: 109
I think that an apparatus like this is a great idea but keep in mind that anything moving, particularly in a harmonic way will experience fatigue and eventually fail. Cost to maintain vs energy produced? We simply need a true superconductor and all is answered.
ngeoym is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-14-2009   #19
ric's Avatar
Fruita, Colorado
Paddling Since: 1982
Join Date: Apr 2004
Posts: 201
energy tech?

Side note to science minded buzzards!
checkout Nova's Race to Absolute Zero, superconductivity! chapter 9 is my fav,
Also, Nano-dreadlocs! google it! posible way to store or transport electrons?
I built off grind home miles from power lines, installed PV and wind system
works great! going strong for ten years, only two lighting strikes!

ric is offline   Reply With Quote

Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off

Similar Threads
Topic Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Double rail frame alternative raftus Whitewater Kayaking 12 12-17-2009 12:40 PM
Light alternative to rocket boxes lhowemt Kayaking | Gear Talk 36 12-15-2008 11:47 AM
How many of you use Wind Power? sj Whitewater Kayaking 5 04-18-2006 01:10 PM
Wind readings? Dave Frank Winter Buzz 2 12-26-2005 01:38 PM
Wind Rivers (WY) creeks merry prankster Whitewater Kayaking 3 07-08-2004 08:34 PM

» Classified Ads
Blizzard Zero G 85 (171)...

posted by rboater7

Blizzard Zero G 85 AT skis, 171 length, with Pomoco Climb...

13' raft and frame

posted by glen0022p

13' Rocky Mountain raft with frame-3 oars - cooler and dry...

Outcast Commander Demo...

posted by Riverboat Works

Perfect for the solo fisherman. Row thru the tough spots,...

Powered by vBadvanced CMPS v3.2.3

Our Communities

Our communities encompass many different hobbies and interests, but each one is built on friendly, intelligent membership.

» More about our Communities

Automotive Communities

Our Automotive communities encompass many different makes and models. From U.S. domestics to European Saloons.

» More about our Automotive Communities

Marine Communities

Our Marine websites focus on Cruising and Sailing Vessels, including forums and the largest cruising Wiki project on the web today.

» More about our Marine Communities

Copyright 2002-2012 Social Knowledge, LLC All Rights Reserved.

All times are GMT -6. The time now is 01:38 PM.

Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.8 Beta 1
Copyright ©2000 - 2016, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.