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Old 11-02-2006   #81
Georgia Moonshine
Join Date: Oct 2006
Posts: 173
Thanks for responding everytime. That makes this thread and Kerry (in the senate he his mockingly called, "Woodenhead") making and idiot of himself in the u-tube clip to the top of the list each time. Thank you.

One should never interupt an opponent when he makes mistakes, but this is getting old El FartCo (eye cant spel gud, am frum redd stait, wint to pooblic skool) .

love that bug eyed guy

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Old 11-02-2006   #82
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Golden, Colorado
Paddling Since: 1984
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Now that you've completely regressed into name-calling and have disregarded any evidence that directly challenges your statements, it's painfully clear that you really are over your head. I'm done with you. It's a shame you can't have a civil discussion and actually back up your convictions. But, it's what I suspected all along, so I'm not surprised.

and... You're Welcome! Come back for a whuppin' anytime.

PS- Jack Murtha retaired as a colonel, not a general. He was in the Marines for 37 years, and obviously served in Southeast Asia. Contact his office and request that you give him that geography lesson. Maybe you can tell him your brave stories of almost passing the color tests at the Merchant Marine Academy. That was riveting.

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Old 11-02-2006   #83
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Denver, Colorado
Join Date: Jan 2004
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Perhaps Kerry meant exactly what he said, I find it unlikely, but only he and his speech writers know for sure. Sure, he could have rewritten his prepared speech notes and released them after he saw what a stink it made. Again, I find it unlikely but possible. Why debate it anymore?

But... the interpretation that the right prefers is actually quite accurate, whether Kerry intended to say it or not-- I graduated high school in '91 from a class of ninety-two people in rural Indiana when Kuwait was a big deal. My grades were just good enough to get into Purdue; I took out loans and worked year 'round to afford it. My friends who joined up didn't do it out of some sense of honor or duty. They were just poor kids who couldn't afford or didn't have the grades to continue their education. Some just weren't scholars, others made their priorities football, baseball, working the farm, etc. and didn't think about what they were going to do when they graduated. Also, we had perhaps the worst guidance counselor in the state. Google "military recruiters" and see what kind of tactics are used to recruit highschoolers and what schools are targeted. Most 18 year-olds are too busy trying to get laid to feel strongly about politics or feel duty bound. I don't find the right's interpretation offensive, I find it horribly accurate and our military recruiters exploit it. I do know some exceptions, two friends that came from a military tradition in their family, but this was not the majority in my experience. I'm sure I'm going to get slammed hard for this, I KNOW THERE ARE EXCEPTIONS, but this is often the case.

Part of the "No Child Left Behind" law has a provision requiring public secondary schools to provide military recruiters not only with access to facilities, but also with contact information for every student -- or face a cutoff of all federal aid.

The Senate Appropriations Committee's education committee has approved a shamefully inadequate funding bill for FY 2007. The bill:

Cuts overall education funding below both current levels and those in the bill passed by the House Appropriations Committee.
Cuts funding for programs under No Child Left Behind by $377 million and freezes Title I funding at current levels.
Includes in the NCLB cuts a reduction of $140 million in funding for Title II Teacher Quality State Grants.
Freezes most education programs at current levels and eliminates some key programs, including dropout prevention.
Provides no increase at all for IDEA.
Freezes the Pell Grant maximum award at $4,050.


Canon fodder has to come from somewhere.

I think this is double ungood.

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Old 11-02-2006   #84
Denver, Colorado
Paddling Since: 1999
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First: Troutbobber. You are only fooling yourself. Good luck with that.

another addition to CGM's comment:
As long as we are there, we should do things properly and bomb the whole damn country into submission, until they are groveling at our knees. Then we can figure out a plan for turning the country back over to the Iraqies.
Will there even be any Iraqis left if we bomb the whole country into submission? And why stop at Iraq. Let's keep on going with more ethnic cleansing. I mean, sooner or later these ignorant people will realize that we are far superior (that's satire, just so you know) BTW-not all people in these areas are "terrorists." And if rationalizing their deaths by labeling them "collateral damage" makes you feel better then try this exercise out: Imagine that your mom was killed by a bomb, and while you are at her funeral the guy who dropped the bomb says, "well, she was just unfortunate collateral damage." How would you feel about that?

It worked in WWII with the Germans. They couldn't even breath without our permission when that war was over, and it took a long time for them to become a productive part of the world again, but it happened. (the subjegation of the German people, men, women and children is a FACT)

I think you are missing the bigger picture here, my friend. Sure, it worked back then. And, yes, it stopped an evil dictator from ruling the world. But, this is a completely different scenario. And let's not forget that the stakes are much higher in this day and age of nuclear warfare. Don't think that we are the only ones who have them?? (Pakistan, China, and now N. Korea, and who knows where all the other Soviet nukes went) Also, don't kid yourself by thinking the US and Israel aren't using them right now... http://www.zmag.org/content/showarti...7&ItemID=11297

There are many different scientific studies out there that try to simulate what would happen to the environment and people after such drastic radiation discharges were put into the atmosphere from a full scale war. And, let's not kid ourselves. Just because these bombs would be detonated in a far, far land from America does not mean that the weather pattern would decide to spare Americans and stop circulating the radiation worldwide...ya know...the winds that blow from the West. Just imagine going to Vallecito or The Crystal Gorge with a grey smog of radiation hanging over your head. So while you're hucking waterfalls, bro, you can think about that.

Oh, and let's not forget that todays nuclear weapons are much bigger than the ones used on Japan. Nobody really knows what will exactly happen to the atmosphere and people. But, DO YOU WANT TO FIND OUT??? I don't, so let's put the "blow them into submission" back into the barbaric category where it belongs and let's try to EVOLVE into humans beings who have sympathy, dignity and compassion for others. Or, at least evolve to something better than our current state of "barbarians with technology." The quote on the bottom of my post should be taken seriously. In this possibly terminal phase of human existence, I think, it would be wise to let go of the old dysfunctional ways of being...

Here are some examples of what may result from Nuclear war. This is from the US Energy Department:
"Recent findings by this group confirmed by workers in Europe, the US and the USSR, suggest that the long-term climatic effects of a major nuclear war are likely to be much severer and farther-reaching than had been supposed.^In the aftermath of such a war vast areas of the earth could be subjected to prolonged darkness, abnormally low temperatures, violent windstorms, toxic smog and persistent radioactive fallout - in short, the combination of conditions that has come to be known as nuclear winter."

This one is from the New England Journal of Medicine:
"Conclusions The risk of an accidental nuclear attack has increased in recent years, threatening a public health disaster of unprecedented scale. Physicians and medical organizations should work actively to help build support for the policy changes that would prevent such a disaster."

Oh, here's another one:
At Hiroshima and Nagasaki, the few surviving doctors observed symptoms of radiation sickness for the first time. In his book Nagasaki 1945, Dr. Tatsuichiro Akizuki wrote of the puzzling, unknown disease, of symptoms that "suddenly appeared in certain patients with no apparent injuries." Several days after the bombs exploded, doctors learned that they were treating the effects of radiation exposure. "We were now able to label our unknown adversary 'atomic disease' or 'radioactive contamination' among other names. But they were only labels: we knew nothing about its cause or cure... Within seven to ten days after the A-bomb explosion, people began to die in swift succession. They died of the burns that covered their bodies and of acute atomic disease. Innumerable people who had been burnt turned a mulberry color, like worms, and died... The disease," wrote Dr. Akizuki, "destroyed them little by little. As a doctor, I was forced to face the slow and certain deaths of my patients."
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Old 11-02-2006   #85
Join Date: Apr 2004
Posts: 254
TB - i find it humorous that you are holding onto the JK thing (and this thread) as justification to vote republican. I think that you need to re-evaluate who you support and why. really, this shows just how weak your current party is. Where are the real conservatives out there. How long till they wake up and take the party back? there's tons of valient reasons to be conservative, but supporting this current bunch of crooks is not one of them.

CGM - sorry to "call you out", but it was definately intentional as i am quite shocked by many of your views, and think you are one extreme dude. I think that you long for a country like iran or north korea instead of a democracy. as far as social security, there's been talk for years about it running out, and it is still going, so i am a little skeptical of the doom and gloom picture. again, i hugely disagree with you and rush about the media being a problem for the war...america is a democracy, founded on the principles of openness, morality, judiciousness, checks and balences (of which the media is a part, expecially since there is one party control over all 3 branches of the US), and equal rights. the fact that you don't want anyone to know what our government is doing is contradictory to america (IMO). The fact that you believe that we should "bomb the country into submission, until they are groveling at our knees", and "the country that kills the most people, wins" shows the right wing problem here:

I think that this islamic fundamentalism/terrorism war is different than the conventional. We can (and have) easily kill more people than them. Have we won? your answear is to kill more. I guess my point is that killing every last non-american is not a solution, becasue even though you probably find it morally acceptable, it is not a practical solution. So killing more of them is still not a solution, becasue given that you can't kill every last one of them, and in this age, a few people can have a big impact over many others (9/11) - it is our country that is right freak'n now building a backpack nuclear bomb...in this day and age, we need to refine our tacticts. I don't think you have the right solution. I think the real solution is to evaluate why they hate and want to kill us. Understanding that will show us the path towards peace. I think that if we took TB, CGM, and rush, and had them grow up in an islamic funamentalist culture, they would be just as extreme. so my long winded point is that it is incorrect to demonize our enemy as "evil" and worthy of death. We need to understand their perspective.

I do respect you (CGM) for stating your views intelligently, and even signing your name to your quite unpopular views. I hope that we can run something together sometime, so please don't send your militia after me!
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Old 11-02-2006   #86
I'm wrong 50% of the time
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Paddling Since: 1977
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Posts: 857
now we have something that should polarize us. Cutting funding for education. WTF Our great leaders at work(dems and GEO). Did they give themselves a raise the same day?
If we do not change our collective mindset, we are going to surrender to the Chinese next century. (I just saying)
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Old 11-02-2006   #87
Georgia Moonshine
Join Date: Oct 2006
Posts: 173
Name Calling? Lest see here, well I may be guilty of that, but I am not the only one on here engaging in said low behavior:

From El Flaco the Magnificent:

you're not even a boater.
Said quite early in the discussion and a give away line you prolly use with anyone you disagree with.

"Trout Bobber RLRBLDR 4EVA"
picture, meant to deride me, but one that I found funny as heck, need to figure out this avatar thing works

Nice one, you don't even know me

Dude- you're lying
Were you there in the office when the Officer told me that I might cause a collision between tankers?

Dang, CAPT Hazelwood of the Exxon Valdez could have used me as a scape-goat fer sure.

being a tool.
nice one, must took all day to come up with that witty reply.

Polynodial cysts on your bum
Just plain nasty, but seems to be in keeping with comments suggesting that I perform felatio on the President made by others. Colorado, where the men are men and the cattle are nervous!!!

You keep feeding the troll, you refuse to imagine anything outside your world view, and are nasty to say the least. You will make a fine admin.
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Old 11-02-2006   #88
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Denver, Colorado
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Troutbobber, I wish you would do some trout bobbing on the presidents lap, then we would have sufficient reason to impeach.
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Old 11-02-2006   #89
Denver, Colorado
Paddling Since: 1994
Join Date: Jun 2004
Posts: 325
Let's get a few things straight:
a) I did not propose using nuclear weapons in Iraq or anywhere else. Its one of two things that scare me, the other being Carnival Folk, small hands, smell like cabage. I don't know how to win the war, but I don't think a nuclear weapon is the answer. I agree, this is a new type of war, in which conventional tactics won't work. I do get a little fired up when I think about how to win the war and bring our troops home. And so I say "fuck it, lets just kill them all." Not the most humane or well articulated strategy, but the premise is still the same: win the war and get out. I agree we have to understand our enemy, and why they want to kill us (I am speaking more generally of terrorists here), but that doesn't mean that I have to sympathize with them, or like them, or appreciate them or anything about them. Although I have been thinking about getting my girlfriend a berca (spelling??). I believe we should use our knowledge to our advantage to win the war.
b) I don't propose cutting/limiting all social programs, especially NOT eductation
c) I absolutely did not propose, nor do I condone genocide in any way shape or form. I'd like to be especially adamant about this fact.
d) I don't think that letting the army do its job without the media interfering puts me into the same category of those that actually want a dictatorship like North Korea or Iran. The point that I may not have articulated well enough is that I believe the media allows politicians to use the war as a political pawn based on the sentiments of the American people. This tactic, IMO does not win wars.
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Old 11-02-2006   #90
Join Date: Oct 2003
Posts: 342
So... has anyone changed their view on Iraq or their political beliefs since this stupid argument started? I didn't think so. This is what I suggest, you go to the poles and vote on which of our 2 lousy political parties can best lead this country. Don't give this Trout guy the time of day. Sorry... but I'm fed up with all this bushit.

By the way, I think there were some good points made, but they may be falling on deff ears.

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