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Old 10-02-2011   #11
snakester's Avatar
Mesa, Colorado
Paddling Since: 2010
Join Date: Apr 2011
Posts: 161
Redpaddle, thanks for the encouragement!

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Old 10-02-2011   #12
openboat's Avatar
Longmont, Colorado
Paddling Since: 1986
Join Date: Jul 2004
Posts: 227
I have a Dagger Genesis whitewater canoe, complete with a saddle, thigh straps and foot pegs. Air bags fill fore and aft. It is paddled with a single blade. I've been paddling it for a long time, and love it. You can get a bigger thrill in a whitewater canoe on smaller water than in any other whitewater boat, in my opinion. IIs and IIIs are a blast.

There is a steeper learning curve for ww canoes - not so much due to their instability (seems about the same as flatwater canoe stability to me), but the high rocker makes it difficult at first to move it where you want it to go. I recommend you get a copy of the dvd by Kent Ford called Drill Time. He probably has several different programs out there, as well as a book, actually. Kent was my ACA certification instructor years ago, and really knows his stuff.

If you would like more info, or maybe try to figure out a way to get together sometime and work on moves, PM me.

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Old 10-03-2011   #13
Carbondale, Colorado
Join Date: Aug 2009
Posts: 317
I just bought a very well used encore or ovation dagger oc-1 a few months ago (i'm not even sure which one it is). I have a raft, but have never kayaked. I am having a blast in this canoe. I've haven't found anyone in the roaring fork valley to go out with, so I've been self teaching. There's a book (so I've been told) and a movie called "path of the paddle" that I downloaded for $4 from Canadian Public Television. It's old and hokey, but this guy does amazing things in a canoe. It's a good start. It will take you from thinking about paddling a canoe from 2 to 3 dimensions. This guys son wrote a book called "thrill of the paddle" about whitewater/playboat canoeing. Along with "Paddle your own Canoe" (both of which I got from Garfield public libraries), it's given me a base to get on the river and have a ton of fun. Yes, they're tippy. Yes, kneeling for more than 20 minutes at a time in a canoe sucks. No, it's not as hard as people make it out to be. I'm also getting tired of this stupid tele-skiing/ww canoeing analogy. Using a canoe paddle adds a whole new dimension to paddling in moving water. Teleskiing is just a really crappy way to only use one edge effectively and then just lean back and make poor alpine turns when it gets steep.
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Old 10-03-2011   #14
Redpaddle's Avatar
Newport, Oregon
Paddling Since: 1989
Join Date: Jan 2007
Posts: 206
I have "Thrill of the Paddle" a quality book with a lot of info and great pictures. It'll shut anyone up that says Canoeing is for class II and below. The only drawback to canoeing is it can be colder, even if you don't swim. I sure love my drysuit!

Alpine/Tele, Kayak/Canoe, Spin/fly fishing, automatic/5 speed, Short/Longboard, 21 speed/fixie, briefs/boxers.

Each has their place, analogies are descriptive only, don't gotta be a hater! Except when it comes to briefs, those things are f-in uncomfortable. Free your junk free your mind!
"Paddle silently, boof loudly"
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Old 10-03-2011   #15
openboat's Avatar
Longmont, Colorado
Paddling Since: 1986
Join Date: Jul 2004
Posts: 227
Originally Posted by watermonkey View Post
Yes, kneeling for more than 20 minutes at a time in a canoe sucks.
There are ways to lessen the discomfort. I have foam blocks shaved to fit under my ankles so that the feet don't have to flatten out. If I'm missing an ankle block, I have substituted a throw bag. I assume you have good knee pads, and that the saddle is the right height so that your knees aren't too tightly flexed. When I am on the river for hours, I find myself coming up off the saddle for a minute or two to restore circulation and use other muscles. I've been able to paddle a full day with only a little stiffness when I take out.
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Old 10-04-2011   #16
Nosebleed, Colorado
Paddling Since: 1977
Join Date: May 2008
Posts: 138
It takes my knees three days to break in at the beginning of the season. Openboat's comments on properly customizing your ride are key. If you use a farmer john and want to go "convict fashion" cut out the backs of the knees--helps relieve pressure on the knees.
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Old 10-04-2011   #17
Longmont, Colorado
Paddling Since: 2002
Join Date: May 2009
Posts: 25
Snakester, have you figured out what model it is?
If there aren't any markings, you could take a look at Daggers old catalogs - note, they stopped making canoes back in 2003 so look at the catalogs from 2003 and before:
Archived Catalogs - Dagger Kayaks

Also, as far as the interwebs goes: is the place for all things c and oc-boating related.

As already pointed out, customizing your outfitting is the key to a comfortable ride. Wide saddle, ankle blocks, kneepads, saddle height, etc... Shaving (or adding) just an 1/8 inch of foam in the right place can make all the difference in the world. It will take awhile to figure out, but just keep experimenting.

One last thing, if you paddle with a lot of kayakers, you might want to install an electric bilge pump. Most yakers will usually paddle downriver alot faster than a canoe that has to dump water all the time. Yeah, it defeats the purist nature of running a "dry line" but your friends won't bitch and moan about waiting for you all the time.
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Old 10-04-2011   #18
boulder, Colorado
Paddling Since: 1975
Join Date: Sep 2009
Posts: 42
"half th paddle, twice th man" is what ive heard male open canoers respond to th yakkers
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Old 10-04-2011   #19
snakester's Avatar
Mesa, Colorado
Paddling Since: 2010
Join Date: Apr 2011
Posts: 161
I'd really like to try and get on the water with some of you guys that own one (of these canoes) sometime. I know I have to repair a hole in one of the air bladders. It looks like there is a little mouth tube that is missing from one.Do you know what I'm talking about? I haven't aired these up or anything yet as I just got the boat home yesterday, but I sat in it and strapped in, on the grass, and adjusted the foot pegs. I doubt I'll try it out before next summer, but who knows.
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Old 10-05-2011   #20
welch, Oklahoma
Paddling Since: 1976
Join Date: Apr 2009
Posts: 207
I started paddling a canoe in 1976 and found it great . In the 80's Iwas doing 8 ft drops and even a 16 water fall [the landing was pretty rough] all in a madriver explorer . I paddled 17 ft blue hole and then went to various new style canoe . First flotation was a truck intertube, that Austin Holmes gave me to run the snake river at 32000 cfs in jackson hole Wyo] At the time I thought I was the hottest paddler going --that was short lived . Now the radical stuff is so much out there that the magical runs I did are mere childs play today.
Any way enjoy your boat and you will really learn to read water and line

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