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Old 03-22-2011   #11
Jenks, Oklahoma
Join Date: Oct 2004
Posts: 1,408
My bet is like slamkal, posilockers being nice but not for this type of accident.

Never seen a cataract break (in a jam situation as posted, I can visualize a breaking force that something had to give) but I use open oarlocks with straps with cataract shaft and carlise heavy duty blades. I know the plus and minus of straps but accept the issues.

I have seen several carlise oar shafts bent pretty bad on jams - especially pins and clips. stick the oar shaft between two trees and bend back out to finish the trip.

boils down to what the rower wants to do for a setup and technique and a lot of luck.

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Old 03-22-2011   #12
Jenks, Oklahoma
Join Date: Oct 2004
Posts: 1,408
Ihowemt, amazing story. Thanks for the post. Sure glad things worked out. Sometimes the force leaves us for a time but usually it comes back!

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Old 03-22-2011   #13
lhowemt's Avatar
at my house, Montana
Paddling Since: 2020
Join Date: Apr 2007
Posts: 4,347
I completely disagree Oakie. This sort of an incident is exactly why I got the posilockers. I'm 100% confident that if I had open oarlocks, I would have not had any oar, and do not want to think about how my run would have gone from there. I am glad to have sacrificed one oar for the sake of saving one. If both oars had popped (as with open oarlocks), I would not have had anything to line up with, and nothing to spin into the eddy. I most likely would have flipped again, and the thought of having to self-rescue again was not something I could have conceived of. I probably would have ridden my boat through at least 1, maybe 3 more Class IV+/V- rapids. Perhaps someone would have been able to corral me to the one half way decent eddy in that section, but probably not.

Of course, there is always the possibility that both oars could have been broken and then I'd have been worse off. Although I can't picture retrieving and reinserting popped oars in that section, while holding on to my boat. At least one oar was broken the weekend before from open oarlocks, but his boat went much further than mine (all the rapids). It's not unexpected to break an oar in this sort of an upside down situation.

Much discussion after the fact, esp with people who had other carnage over those two weekends, led us all to agree that often our own rigging choices are a result of our own experiences and beat-downs. And then we each end up with something different. And then change it again, and again, and again. Or at least question it.

Here's some video, it's not very close but it does show how big the drop was that I went over (only because I dropped out of sight). If you watch closely you can see I got cady-whompus early on (10 s, before he zoomed in). If you continue watching closely you can see what I went over, probably the bigger pointy rock. There is a line over there, however I now understand I was about 1.5' off. The level was getting into the high range, not a time to be exploring new lines (I wasn't trying to).

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Old 03-22-2011   #14
Beaverton, Oregon
Paddling Since: 2005
Join Date: Jun 2010
Posts: 569
Wow! I barely recognized that portion of the Wind. Most kayakers prefer it in the 5-6' range.

That is not a swim I'd enjoy!
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Old 03-22-2011   #15
Jenks, Oklahoma
Join Date: Oct 2004
Posts: 1,408
Great video, heck of a swim, glad you are telling the story to us!

I defer to your personal decision - if posilockers work best for you, that is a great deal. I see your point. Like I posted oars windmilling around on a lease could also be a hazard to deal with. I just like open oarlocks for a lot of reasons - some would makes sense to others some maybe just to me.

Glad you ended up back at that one oar!
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Old 03-22-2011   #16
Missoula, Montana
Paddling Since: 1996
Join Date: Mar 2010
Posts: 84
STOP THE PRESSES! Cataract Oars are better than Carslyle. Holy shit. Who knew?
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Old 03-22-2011   #17
Boise, Idaho
Join Date: Feb 2011
Posts: 427
If you read the thread it ended up being more about oar locks and a class V flip scenario...and your spelling could use some work
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Old 03-22-2011   #18
Rainy Northwest, Washington
Paddling Since: 1980
Join Date: Feb 2009
Posts: 460
"but his boat went much further than mine (all the rapids). It's not unexpected to break an oar in this sort of an upside down situation." That was me, twisty flip above Rams Horn. I had a cataract oar snap in half, and lost another when the NRS tether pulled apart. Bent my PRE frame. Expensive wreck, and the MRI on my leg is scheduled for tomorrow. The takeaway is that a long Class IV-V swim is a beat down, and that rivers are random. If I would have had a chicken line on the side of my boat, I could have held on and re-flipped. Or I might have gotten a foot caught in it, hit my head as hard as I hit my leg, and died. A frame grab might have let me hold on, or could have busted my fingers. Cataract oars broke, carlisles would have bent. But my folding plastic seat was the cockroach survivor with just a few scratches.
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Old 03-22-2011   #19
s, Virginia
Join Date: Mar 2011
Posts: 95
I hope you MRI comes back negative, glad you did not hit your head and die!
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Old 03-23-2011   #20
slamkal's Avatar
vancouver, Washington
Paddling Since: 1996
Join Date: Apr 2009
Posts: 1,146
Originally Posted by Marco Esquandolis
STOP THE PRESSES! Cataract Oars are better than Carslyle. Holy shit. Who knew?
Wait. I thought for pole vaulting they came up with the alternate conclusion

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carlisle, cataract

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