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Old 01-06-2014   #1
Salina, Kansas
Paddling Since: 2011
Join Date: Jan 2014
Posts: 2
Changing water of choice

Long time open water kayaker looking for a little input: I currently have a Dagger Alchemy S, and a Pyrahna Fusion S as rock garden boats, neither are great WW boats. I am used to low volume, tight fitting touring boats. I am at the upper range of weight on the Fusion, making it even worse as a WW boat.
I have tried on a Dagger Green Boat and the LL Stinger, hooked on the stinger XP for use on extended trips, and it is the closest to the touring boats I am used to.
I cant wrap my head around not having a sealed bulkhead in the rear, why have access and not have the ability to seal it up?
Also, is it common to not have flotation bags front and rear in creekers since turning your boat into a cleopatra needle is not a huge concern? I have a solid roll in either direction, but still have not mastered not leaning upriver, so wet exit is still pretty frequent, not a huge fan of a large volume boat full of water.
I am the first of my "group" to start river running, so I have become the test dummy.

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Old 01-06-2014   #2
adgeiser's Avatar
Denver,, exhaustion
Join Date: May 2009
Posts: 578
Welcome to the dark side.
I also came from a sea kayaking background. It does make the learning curve easier.

Always use float bags front and back in your creeker. Always. Otherwise your crew will really start to get peaved when trying to get a creeker full of water back to shore. ( it's a royal pain)

I would also advise against trying to match what you are used to.
Go with the boat that's going to do what you want to do.... Not where you are coming from. Think about if you have never backcountry skied before only cross country skied. You want to chase deep powder... Going with the skinnier ones because they are closer to what you are used to isn't going to help.
Go with the right boat and you will learn faster and have more fun doing it.

Oh yeah don't skimp on the helmet.

"We should restore the practice of dueling. It might improve manners around here" -Edward Abbey
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Old 01-07-2014   #3
Sumas, Chilliwack, BC
Paddling Since: 2012
Join Date: Oct 2013
Posts: 120
Try leaning downriver, works better leaving an eddy ..LOL. Previous advice is good, buy a boat for the purpose intended, the green boat and stinger are primarily for racing. Get a river runner or creeker while you learn. Zen, Mamba and Diesel are all great first boats for river running and store enough for overnighters. A lot can be packed in a 9' or less boat.
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Old 01-07-2014   #4
Salina, Kansas
Paddling Since: 2011
Join Date: Jan 2014
Posts: 2
I still have problems edging

In touring boats you edge by leaning outside of the turn, tough to change old ways.
I thought tide races and rock gardening would convert easily into WW, not so much. It seems like getting the boat to plane out and nose attitude is a lot more important than in big water boating.
I am not even sure what hull shapes and different rockers are best for me at this time.
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Old 01-07-2014   #5
caspermike's Avatar
Bozeman, Montana
Paddling Since: 1999
Join Date: Mar 2007
Posts: 5,507
Try a liquid logic remix long and really beginner friendly. Really sweet boat the stinger is a longer version of the remix
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Old 01-10-2014   #6
Worcestershire, Midlands, UK
Paddling Since: 2010
Join Date: Dec 2010
Posts: 52
Airbags in the front of your boat will also help stop the front end from caving in during impacts while the owner is busy swimming down the river

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