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Old 07-15-2008   #91
Join Date: Oct 2003
Posts: 15
Originally Posted by Canada View Post

I also taught a course at some of my clients teaching hoispitals on how not to get sued. You know what the number one reason people sued my clients. The nurse told them they should.

Can you provide your data/research to back this statement. It is a pretty bold statement and one that I think is probably inaccurate.

highspeed is offline  
Old 07-15-2008   #92
Boulder, Colorado
Paddling Since: 2007
Join Date: Sep 2007
Posts: 94
This thread is very telling of a very serious issue!

A problem was identified and question was asked. Why was the professional rescue group not helping to their fullest, unorganized, unqualified, and questioned?

Surgass put forth every effort possible to save this guy yet the people defending the EMTs and making threats are the people that compose the group that is in question. Almost every post by EMTs on this thread are defensive and questionable, telling that there really is an issue that needs to be addressed. Not one of the responses defending the EMT groups sounds like a person I would want saving me or anyone that means anything to me.

On top of that she states that she put in a few calls to get some answers and was ignored. Well she certainly has your attention now doesn't she.

With that said how is it possible that these people are paid by our tax dollars to provide a service that they appear unwilling to provide?

This truly is scary that people representing these groups are here stating the comments that they have.

As for the threats of it being inappropriate to post here I would fully disagree. My tax dollars pay your salary and your attitude is unacceptable for someone who is supposed to save lives. To fry the chick that actually tried. That is some serious bullshit.

jbarnow is offline  
Old 07-15-2008   #93
Boulder, Colorado
Paddling Since: 2003
Join Date: Jul 2008
Posts: 3
the facts

I have logged on to this blog to answer the facts of what we know of the horrible afternoon of 6/20. The group consisted of 5 boats, 2 duckies, and one kayak. We set off from the pumphouse put-in around 1:30 in the afternoon after driving up from Boulder. We were planing to float for 2 nights, 3 days and take out at Dotsero. There was drinking on the trip, but at the point that we went into the caynon the most anybody have had was about 2 beers. The 2 duckies went into the caynon first, Justin and his dog were in one of the duckies. Everyone was wearing PFDs but no helmets. The flow was at about 2200 and the water temp. about 60. I was the third boat to go thru needles, just after going thru I saw Justins boat uncaptianed floating down river. At this piont we were scanning for him and saw his dog on a small ledge on river left. We attemted to rescue the dog but were unsuccessful. 20 yards down river the other ducky and kayak had eddied and comunicated to us that Justin was safe on river right, just below needles. We procieded down river to get Justins boat. We retrieved his boat and eddied out at the historic cabin. We waited there until all other boats arrived (about 20minutes since seeing Justins boat), the last in our group arrived with Justins dog but without Justin. We asked all passing boats if they saw anyone, but no one did. One man hiked back up river to try to locate Justin, just as he was getting back we saw a man on the raillroad tracks(30 min. from seeing his boat) we assumed it was Justin and headed towards him downriver. It was the captian of the first boat in our group, we eddied out again.(40 min. from seeing his boat). 5 minutes later a group was passing and asked if we were missing anyone, we said yes and they sceamed that they had him (not in such kind words but we forgive what people say in such a tragic moment). We immediately took off behind them, but were 15 minutes at the fastest to the Radium takeout. We dropped off runners to try to make it faster to call for help. By the time we got to the takeout it had been a little over an hour from seeing Justins boat uncaptianed. A BLM officer arrived just after Justin was on shore, The first ambulance was there 10 minutes after Justin got on shore at Radium. I heard that a train driver had called 911. It was about 45 minutes from Justin was on shore that Flight for Life arrived. It was a tragic afternoon that has left a lot of questions... I thank everyone that helped that afternoon.

Brady is offline  
Old 07-15-2008   #94
castle rock, Colorado
Paddling Since: 1996
Join Date: Jun 2008
Posts: 203
Thanks brady for clearing this all up. I am truley sorry for the loss. I know I will get some flak for this for bringing it up more but were you there when grand county ems showed up and was the crew that first showed up just not caring? Agin I am truley sorry for the loss.

dograft83 is offline  
Old 07-15-2008   #95
Boulder, Colorado
Paddling Since: 2003
Join Date: Jul 2008
Posts: 3
The people that were working on Justin seemed more experineced than both the EMS crews, as far as I know there was 2 nurses and 2 doctors on site. It does not surprise me that the EMS were critisized, it was a situation that they could not control with such seniority allready there. It must of been a difficult situation for them.
Brady is offline  
Old 07-15-2008   #96
castle rock, Colorado
Paddling Since: 1996
Join Date: Jun 2008
Posts: 203
Thanks now we all can hopefully stop talking smake to one another.
dograft83 is offline  
Old 07-15-2008   #97
Durango, Colorado
Paddling Since: 1980
Join Date: Jul 2008
Posts: 60
Some of this reminds me of the old George Carlin routine.

Somewhere out there is the worst doctor in the world.

Or Garrison Keiller: Where all the women are good looking and all the children are above average.

EMT's and Paramedics screw up. There is nothing wrong with talking about it.

Nothing wrong with holding people accountable.
original durangotang is offline  
Old 07-15-2008   #98
Park City, Utah
Paddling Since: 1985
Join Date: Oct 2006
Posts: 700
Originally Posted by highspeed View Post
Can you provide your data/research to back this statement. It is a pretty bold statement and one that I think is probably inaccurate.
I PM'd you. Let me know if it didn't work. It's the first time I've done that.
Canada is offline  
Old 07-15-2008   #99
DENVER, Colorado
Join Date: Jul 2008
Posts: 23
Brady, I think you are a wonderful friend. My thoughts of you and not knowing you were what a good friend you were to Justin. I did not know him but you let me hold his wallet and see his license. I know people think I'm crazy as a loon on this site but I needed to see him as he really was. This is how I want to remember him, not the way that we found him. Please understand why I wrote this, not to criticize anyone. You saw me that day I was a mess. Yes, I thought we could save him. I'm so glad you responded to this thread, I have wondered about you and hope that you are okay. Oops just received your PM, sorry pass it on to Mat then. Thanks Brady, I appreciate hearing from the people close to him.
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Old 07-15-2008   #100
Boulder, Colorado
Paddling Since: 2003
Join Date: Jul 2008
Posts: 3
thanks, I will let Mat know.

Brady is offline  
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