bwest, It is almost impossible to gauge the upper Tonto through Hells Gate and even harder for Chris Creek as there are tribs coming in from differing areas and no stream gauges up there. The Tonto gauge is down below the 76 ranch after the Pittsburg Box. Hells Gate can be run as can Chris Creek at anything over 100+ with advanced boaters going through at 600+. These creeks are bony at low flow. Stories tell about fast water, blind drops over 15', blind corners in narrow granite channels, killer strainers, any number of recircs, scarce rescue eddys and bitch cold water.