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Old 10-09-2012   #21
tj@cu's Avatar
Boulder, Colorado
Join Date: Apr 2006
Posts: 983
I think they should go the corey boux route and just make a prono to raise money.

O here is another idea if they are so into progressing the sport by getting exposure on this, then they should all get fucking JOBS and donate everything they make to this cause.

For me I think there are far to many people that get into the kayaking industry with no fucking business background, no idea how to market to the masses. I don't care how great of a boater you are if you are not selling boats/gear for my company I'm not going to give you shit.

And for all the people that think the videos last year were so amazing, you guys should watch them again and think do mainstream people want to watch this? Half the video is dumb asses throwing hand signs, drinking from shoes, and playing shitty fucking music. If they had some story line drama like who is sleeping with who, then maybe they could market themselves as an extreme jersey shore. That's the kind of shit that the mainstream public is into.

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Old 10-09-2012   #22
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leif's Avatar
Fort Collins, Colorado
Paddling Since: 1996
Join Date: Jul 2009
Posts: 481
Really grassroots community events are great, and they probably do help bring in new paddlers. I am in favor of those kinds of events, and actually would really like to organize a big thompson race. I don't think that we're going to have water for it this year.

However, those local events probably mostly appeal to people that already paddle. They serve to help keep those people paddling and get them even deeper into the sport. The WWGP brings kayaking into a new arena. Yeah, you're not going to see a superbowl ad for kayaking, and even if you did, it wouldn't convince 50% of the population to become hardcore kayakers. But if you have a slick video out there, of people running the best water in the world (i.e. water that's worth traveling internationally to get to), then it's going to reach more non-kayakers, and some of those non-kayakers are going to think how cool the sport looks, and maybe try it out. Sponsors from outside the industry (sunglasses companies, etc) are going to see how professionally kayaking can be presented, and might consider sponsoring more paddlers, which brings more money in. I'm not saying that pro paddlers are entitled to rockstar lifestyles traveling the globe and getting drunk. I'm saying that the more that people see, the more funding there is, which facilitates all the things that you probably think of as progression.

I'm always surprised when people are so resistant to this sort of thing. I can sympathize if you don't want to give money, maybe because kayaking is not really a priority in your life. But I am baffled when people seem to imply that promoting the sport is a bad thing. More kayakers and more money lead to more innovations and more progression. Giving money to the WWGP is definitely not the same as giving to AW, but you're not just fleshing out a beer fund for some slackers. It really is something that can help the sport. The more people that we can get interested in kayaking, the more donors there will be for AW.

There are a lot of people opposed. Is there nobody out there that agrees with me?

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Old 10-09-2012   #23
Duluth, Minnesota
Paddling Since: 2007
Join Date: Nov 2011
Posts: 175
When "the public" sees people dropping Palouse or throwing huge air on monster waves, do you really think they're thinking, "Wow dear, we should get a couple kayaks for Johnny and Susie!"? I love watching the videos, but to say its going to grow the sport is bs. **whether the sport needs to be promoted is another issue entirely** The way I see most people coming to the sport is through clubs, and most don't stick with it in the long run anyways.
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Old 10-09-2012   #24
Pittsburgh, Pennsylvania
Paddling Since: 2009
Join Date: Aug 2012
Posts: 18
Originally Posted by caspermike View Post
So the sponsors who aren't funding the event are only in the industry for the money! Ha that biggest bs I have ever heard.
Agreed, I don't think ANYONE in kayaking is "in it for the money". I found that statement borderline retarded. Every WW kayaking outfitter and manufacturer around is constantly struggling to benefit the kayaking industry on thin margins to a bunch of hippies that haven't paid full price for a boat in 10 years. There isn't enough money in the companies to just throw around on BS competitions that don't bring money back in. People who think that need to spend a little more time working for these shops to see how tightly these operations are run.

As you pointed out, donate it to AW if you really want to see someone benefit the sport with your money as well as the environment. These guys take $4k and stretch it out like its' a huge windfall, no idea what they'd do with 100k
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Old 10-09-2012   #25
caspermike's Avatar
Bozeman, Montana
Paddling Since: 1999
Join Date: Mar 2007
Posts: 5,507
Leif your a dick to say we don't want to give money, cause kayaking isn't a priority in our life? Dude go back to whatever planet you are from.

Talk about bringing in people to kayaking using a elitist event screw yourself bro. Kayaking is about fun smiling running sick whitewater in new places and enjoying life and these places to the fullest. Not winning a competition. We depend on each other that's the positive side of kayaking that will draw ten fold the people not just the extremos.

I'll promote the side of the sport I love you promote your side whatever that maybe
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Old 10-09-2012   #26
hojo's Avatar
Lakewood, Colorado
Paddling Since: 1989
Join Date: Jun 2008
Posts: 1,234
Give money if you want to give money. Don't give money if you don't want to or give it to someone else. I've paddled with some of these guys and it's a pretty neat event. I'd like to see more detailed event coverage. Kevin might be pleased to know that I do enjoy knowing about carbon and kevlar fiber and watched all the Olympic slalom. I think that if they need help then this is a good community to ask. I don't think the decision to jump into a very expensive locale w/o sufficient funds was a smart move.
On the river, I can abandon who I am and what I've done. However brief it lasts, while on the river I am nothing important and everything insignificant. I am flotsam, and happy to be so.
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Old 10-09-2012   #27
bobbuilds's Avatar
x, x
Paddling Since: x
Join Date: May 2007
Posts: 1,634
so real quick, Tyler Bradt's family alone has billions, not millions but billions. AND has the type of companys that can add it's losses to the national debt, so...

and the levinson's, or...

but, to say these guys bring no attention to the sport is silly. In this last season alone, i have had more onlookers brown, and ask us what it is and what it means. or what the pitch fork is, tribe rider. people know these guys, exactly along the lines of a jers-day. but it works.

i'd give money, but am to poor.
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Old 10-09-2012   #28
Colorado Springs, Colorado
Paddling Since: 2010
Join Date: May 2012
Posts: 265
My $100 says that after I make a donation and they get their funding that they turn around and charge me $29.95 (plus $13.95 S/H) for the video.
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Old 10-09-2012   #29
Atlantis, .
Join Date: Dec 2010
Posts: 38
1) Chile is a ridiculous place for this race. The logistics are formidable.
2) People who aren't in to kayaking already don't know the difference between the Grand Prix and anything else they're told is cool.
3) There's no money in kayaking (thank god).
4) All the Tribe Riders should just ask their parents for a continuation of the funds that sent them to $30,000 a semester kayaking high schools.
5) No one wants to see more video footage of the Middle Palguin anyway (no matter how beautiful of a drop it is and how stout the ten is).
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Old 10-09-2012   #30
Bethel, Connecticut
Paddling Since: 2005
Join Date: Jun 2009
Posts: 29
I have to say, its almost heartbreaking to hear so many of you hate on this cause. Now, I can't speak on behalf of Tribe or their marketing agenda. But I was one of the videographers during the last event, and I edited a lot of the official video content so many of you rallied behind last year.
I'm not hear to argue, but I'd love to take the opportunity to explain why $100,000 is a very small price tag. Now, I'll first say that I forgive you all for not understanding money... it's not your fault, you're all scumbag boaters and have probably never held more than a few bucks in your wallet
I want to follow that up with "You are not paying boaters to live the rockstar lifestyle". I'm sorry if some of the videos last year made some of you believe this. There was partying, but that was not funded by the WWGP. That came out of each paddler's desire to enjoy their time with good friends.
I'm not sure how familiar any of you are with video needs... but video is expensive. The WWGP had a very small media team. I think it was something like 6 Videographers. Yep, 6 Videographers worked 15+ hour days (Some of us worked more like 19+ hour days if we were editing the pieces) for two weeks without pay. It was extremely grass roots. I for one took, and will have to take 3 weeks off of work to help bring this content to you. It would be great if the media team could make a little money for such hard work.
Sure, we'll be in Chile. And most of us would love for the opportunity. But please don't insult us by saying that we are not slaving our asses off to bring you this content.
Anyway... "paying the media team" aside....
"Is that a 7D?" So many boaters own DSLRs. So you should know what it costs to equip 5 videographers with a camera, enough CF Cards to last the day, batteries to do the same, and enough variation in lenses to keep it interesting.
It's something like 26K.
And we'd like to bring some new technologies to the table. I for one, am gonna flip a shit if I see any more crappy twixtor files in a kayak video. We'd love to see some Sony FS700 footage in the next event's coverage.
The FS700 is the cheapest camera out there capable of shooting great quality, 1080 footage at 240fps. If you haven't seen footage, go check it out.
Anyway, two of these cameras would be nice. It's not over the top.. I promise. But with a price tag of nearly $8k not even including the accessories to keep the camera running... well... we're getting up there...

obviously, this kind of coverage can't be put together when the media team is sleeping in tents. It is important to manage all of this media, and keep things dry and charged. So accommodations are necessary. Typically, its not much, we sleep on the floors when there is time to sleep, but there needs to be a base camp where we can manage the media.

Anyway, with just the equipment, (not including any pay to the media team, or even being able to pay for their plane tickets down there) we are talking around $50K.

And this pricetag only included one lens per camera, no gopros, and no audio equipment or computer to edit any of this on.

I'm sure you will be able to punch holes in this pricetag, but it was only generated to give you all an idea of where some of the money needs come from.

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