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Old 11-05-2004   #1
Livingston's Avatar
Denver, Colorado
Join Date: Jan 2004
Posts: 679
This should clear up some questions

I didn't confirm any of this but the references are below if you feel so inclined, just a cut and paste from a forward...

State Avg. IQ 2004
1 Connecticut 113 Kerry
2 Massachusetts 111 Kerry
3 New Jersey 111 Kerry
4 New York 109 Kerry
5 Rhode Island 107 Kerry
6 Hawaii 106 Kerry
7 Maryland 105 Kerry
8 New Hampshire 105 Kerry
9 Illinois 104 Kerry
10 Delaware 103 Kerry
11 Minnesota 102 Kerry
12 Vermont 102 Kerry
13 Washington 102 Kerry
14 California 101 Kerry
15 Pennsylvania 101 Kerry
16 Maine 100 Kerry
17 Virginia 100 Bush
18 Wisconsin 100 Kerry
19 Colorado 99 Bush
20 Iowa 99 Bush
21 Michigan 99 Kerry
22 Nevada 99 Bush
23 Ohio 99 Bush
24 Oregon 99 Kerry
25 Alaska 98 Bush
26 Florida 98 Bush
27 Missouri 98 Bush
28 Kansas 96 Bush
29 Nebraska 95 Bush
30 Arizona 94 Bush
31 Indiana 94 Bush
32 Tennessee 94 Bush
33 North Carolina 93 Bush
34 West Virginia 93 Bush
35 Arkansas 92 Bush
36 Georgia 92 Bush
37 Kentucky 92 Bush
38 New Mexico 92 Bush
39 North Dakota 92 Bush
40 Texas 92 Bush
41 Alabama 90 Bush
42 Louisiana 90 Bush
43 Montana 90 Bush
44 Oklahoma 90 Bush
45 South Dakota 90 Bush
46 South Carolina 89 Bush
47 Wyoming 89 Bush
48 Idaho 87 Bush
49 Utah 87 Bush
50 Mississippi 85 Bush

The IQ numbers were originally attributed to the book "IQ and the Wealth of
Nations", though they do not appear in the current edition. The tests and
data were administered via the Raven's APT, and the The Test Agency, one of the
UK's leading publishers and distributors of psychometric tests. This data has
been published in the Economist and the St. Petersburg Times, though this does
not mean it should be taken as fact. Though the data does correlate somewhat to
IQ of students per state based on SAT/ACT data, though this would be biased for
those that had completed a high school education. Someone has also taken 2000
census data on percentage of state residents that have earned a college degree
and used that to compare the voting in the 2000 election, it's funny, but that
seems to correlate as well.

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Old 11-05-2004   #2
Spits Hot Fire
N. Cascades, Washington
Join Date: Mar 2004
Posts: 978
Thanks for the info, doesn't surprise me though.

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Old 11-05-2004   #3
BV, Colorado
Join Date: Jun 2004
Posts: 55
that information is quite telling. that is why we appear to be an elitiest group. so since there are far fewer college educated americans than are not, how dow succede at communicating our well thought out and throughly analyzied ideas? this is OUR problem. until we figure this out i am afraid that this nation will continue down its current path. A republican will win again in four years. i just hope that person is not as misguided as bush. i am not trying to be demeaning here, but i would like to think it could be accomplished with out having to sound like bush. its funny the rights accuse of being extreme, but at the end of the day, it was our camp that lacked the emotion. we appealed only to reason, which was our failure because the majority of this nation opperates on instinct and emotion. we have all always been tought that. remember in school, when we were filling out those scan tron tests?, "if you are not sure of the correct answer go with your first instinct". well now the reprocussions of such a practice has become deadly. open your test booklets please and correctly decide the direction of american foreign policy. you have two hours to do so. do not leave any questions blank, if all else fails choose the answer C. thats how the majority of americans have been trained to make decisions.

we're screwed
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Old 11-05-2004   #4
student/ kayaker
Join Date: Oct 2003
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esp- I couldn't agree with you more, I'm glad someone was able to put all that into some words that make sense. It really comes down to people not being able to (or maybe they just don't even consider doing it) analyzing all the stuff they hear on tv and the radio and from other people. If everyone would take a minute to analyze everything that the Bush administration says, I don't see how he could poosibly come out ahead of Kerry. Our entire country needs to start taking everything they hear from Bush with a big old grain of salt.

The attendant at Ted's Place: "And from now on if I'm working when you come in here, you take as much Nacho Cheese for your burrito as you want- it's on me (wink)."
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Old 11-05-2004   #5
Join Date: Mar 2004
Posts: 18
Well, I don't know what this has to do with the forum, since there is great kayaking in all of the above, if one is smart enough to find it. Of course all kayaking is great, compared to boob-tubing!

The data reminds me of the story of the airplane that was going to crash, with one to few parachutes for all of the passengers. One of the passengers insisted that he should be allowed to jump, because he was the smartest man in the world. So grabbing a bag, he jumped out.

The remaining passengers were reassured when it was determined that the smartest man in the world jumped out having grabbed the backpack of a hippie that was on the plane.

Reminds me also, why some kayak and some canoe- Kayakers kayak, because they don't have to determine which end of the paddle goes in the water. I tried canoeing one time, and found it very confusing. The paddle was not the main problem however. The biggest problem was I could not tell which was the bow, and which the stern. Could not tell whether I was coming or going, and I have been told that I have above avg. IQ. So, shows what IQ proves! At least kayaks have seats so that you can tell where you are going, and where you have been, if you gets turned around.

So I guess if it tells anything, it says it takes a WW kayaker to post this sort of data, and think that it is significant dribble! Comes from banging the head full of brains on the boney stream bottom once to many times!

Good thing the future of this country is not based on IQ! or those who think they got it, and the others don't!

Peace, Tinkerntom, aka KnesisKnosis, Life, Live it!
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Old 11-05-2004   #6
BV, Colorado
Join Date: Jun 2004
Posts: 55
just thinking out loud here...

when our nation was in its infant stages, life and communications were much different. the electoral college was set up to not reflect the popular vote. in fact there was no such thing. if any body could come up with the numbers i would be interested to hear them... so i am guessing here... given that we were a rural agrarian nation with little more than guys on horses as a means of communications, i figure we had very low voter turn out, and i cant imagine how ill informed the voting public must have been. for some, i can imagine the treck to the polls taking days. so i am guessing it was mostly the well educated who voted and the electoral college was devised to account for the few 'blip' states who had a good voter turn out. the electoral college was designed to favor the educated vote. just look at the red and blue on the map. pretty damn close in electoral votes considering the see of red and the 3.5 million gap between bush and kerry.

my point is our ability to communicate has far out paced our ability to educate. where previously only the educated that lived at the city centers who had access to the polls, we now have given access to everyone, which is how it should be. but a vote should be a commitment and a privlidge, not just a right. make the commitment to make an informed educated decesion. we, all of us have herd stories from our friends and co-workers saying, "i didnt even know who i was going to vote for till i started to fill out the ballot" to take that point a little further, i too was guilty, i didnt know any of those judges we voted yes and no on. university of colorado board, that was an uneducated decision on my part.

hopefully we can start to become more proactive and less reactive.

sorry for the ramblings
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Old 11-05-2004   #7
BV, Colorado
Join Date: Jun 2004
Posts: 55

i think you mised part of my point, those same tests that are used to determine iqs are quite faulted as we all know. those tests are designed to tell us who are good guessers. as far as the iq numbers there is nothing definitive about them as was stated at the bottom of the original post. there is some correlation that may give us some insight to help us figure out these voting trends. dont be typical by writing off the analysis of those numbers.
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Old 11-05-2004   #8
Join Date: Mar 2004
Posts: 18

I doubt that I am being typical. I just know that stats lie, and those who manipulate them have ulterior motives. To make a correlation between certain observable facts, and the outcome of a political debate, is the fools playground. If you want to play, have fun, but don't confuse facts with fantasy. Fantasy is much to much fun to be confused with the facts.

As for myself I prefer to play in the waterpark! Sometimes I am discovering the source of the Nile, and other times playing like Jacque Cousteau, upside down in my submersible. But the fact is I am still in some runoff puddle in Colorado. The fantasy is much more enjoyable.

Again I am glad that we are able to select a president, not because he is suave, debonaire, and an elite intellectual, but because he puts his pants on one leg at a time like the rest of us. And unlike a previous president, knows how to keep them on! That's the moral value part that no one seems to be talking about, but which I expect made the difference to the average American. We were not ready for another Jiggelowe!

Peace, Tinkerntom, aka KnesisKnosis, Life, Live it!
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Old 11-05-2004   #9
pnw, Washington
Join Date: Oct 2003
Posts: 3,404
I notice some mention of the end of Bush in 4 years. I think you might be overlooking one thing. It would appear that they are grooming Jeb Bush to run in 4 years.
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Old 11-05-2004   #10
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Posts: 168
The Monarchy continues.

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