Roll Critique

[GoodTimes]

Hipsnap.....which is 80% of a roll.

Or knee...never heard of it taught that way, but it makes sense. Whichever method makes more sense to her, I guess.

[PattyNYCO]

I know it sounds weird, but it has proved extremely effective in lessons I have taught over the years. Getting her to engage the knee is the most important thing in what I am trying to say here regardless of how it gets done. Having people practice out of their boat and get a picture in their head of what it should look like can really help. Even if she stands and marches in place with a really high knee - it helps. Quick, powerful JAM that knee!

[KSC]

Remind me not to get on Patty's bad side.

My critique is that Mary has a terrible roll. I'm not much of a teacher, but I tried teaching somebody to roll this past winter. I thought a great technique was to get in some waist deep water and stand in the water with this Mary person, whom you seem to think should be a kayaker, still in her boat.

Have her flip toward you and catch her body/paddle. You can hold her so her head is just above the water, but she's still essentially in a roll setup position. Then have her use her paddle and hip snap to right herself from this position. I think it helps a ton because instead of being disoriented and having the clock ticking underwater, she can setup her paddle with your assistance and figure out the paddle and hip snap motion from a safe starting point. At first you can give some assistance by applying pressure to the paddle as she rolls up and then as she gets the feel for the motion, let her do the paddle entirely by herself. Hope that makes some sense.

[mcfarrel]

I think she needs a bigger hammer

[PattyNYCO]

Originally Posted by KSC

Remind me not to get on Patty's bad side.

My critique is that Mary has a terrible roll. I'm not much of a teacher, but I tried teaching somebody to roll this past winter. I thought a great technique was to get in some waist deep water and stand in the water with this Mary person, whom you seem to think should be a kayaker, still in her boat.

Have her flip toward you and catch her body/paddle. You can hold her so her head is just above the water, but she's still essentially in a roll setup position. Then have her use her paddle and hip snap to right herself from this position. I think it helps a ton because instead of being disoriented and having the clock ticking underwater, she can setup her paddle with your assistance and figure out the paddle and hip snap motion from a safe starting point. At first you can give some assistance by applying pressure to the paddle as she rolls up and then as she gets the feel for the motion, let her do the paddle entirely by herself. Hope that makes some sense.

HAhaha! I am not a violent person, really, I promise :0 Just trying to write in words what I normally demonstrate in person. Your advice about holding her above water is really good! If I may add one more thing: when you are holding her above water, have her rest her head on your shoulder and as she hip snaps, have her push down into your shoulder with her head. It will teach her to keep her head down in the future.

Tuesday lessons with RAGuides at the Golden Rec Center are very good ones for the roll (especially class #3). All of our instructors are ACA Certified.

Ok...I could go on and on, but I will shut-up now.

[MT4Runner]

Originally Posted by PattyNYCO

As long as she JAMS that right knee up and continues to press it into the thigh brace towards the sky until she is all the way upright, she should have an easier time hip-snapping. The knee is EVERYTHING yet it is seldom taught. It will give her a lot of power and confidence. Lots of people respond well with this technique.

Equally important to CONTINUE to pull the knee to the sky until upright.
You can see the instant she stops pulling with her knee--it is at this point that the boat falls back on top of her and she goes back underwater.

Her head position isn't bad. Between her left arm punching and her right knee not pulling, she's going under...she's not lifting her head as badly as some do. Work on the other problems first, and tune out what little head lift she has after she's getting the roll.

Some people start thinking too much about that right knee and then pull up on their left knee as well. For them, a reminder to push down with their left heel--or "get the boat off of you!" is necessary. For others without this problem, don't say anything--it's a distraction.

[Flying_Spaghetti_Monster]

Not like I am an expert, but I am an instructor that was taught by Jimmy Holcome at the NOC. That rolling over on land thing is okay, but if you grab her pfd straps from behind, and help her set up in position with her head above water works best. Feel free to call me, and I will break down what has worked best for my students. I don't feel like typing all of it. 801-678-9130

[Theophilus]

I like what Patty said. I've never liked to call it hip snap because it's really what Patty described and not the hips really at all. I tell them to try to knee themselves in the face.

[seedubs1]

Originally Posted by Flying_Spaghetti_Monster

Not like I am an expert, but I am an instructor that was taught by Jimmy Holcome at the NOC. That rolling over on land thing is okay, but if you grab her pfd straps from behind, and help her set up in position with her head above water works best. Feel free to call me, and I will break down what has worked best for my students. I don't feel like typing all of it. 801-678-9130

Please do type it out if you get a chance. I'm always looking to learn what others experiences are.

[streetdoctor]

Thanks for all the great replies. We're going to try to get back out to a reservoir somewhere around here friday. I've been trying to teach her the knee thing she says she just can't do it underwater though, she knows her hip snap is weak. I'll have her read this thread and maybe do some dry land stuff. I'll get out of my boat and assist her also. If anyone wants to get together at a reservoir friday early afternoon post up!