Thread Tools Display Modes
Old 05-19-2005   #61
adrock's Avatar
Fort Collins/GWS, Colorado
Paddling Since: 1995
Join Date: Apr 2004
Posts: 208
get em down

Ned, getting him going down canyon was a great call.
I would say to anyone, we as a group were slightly torn about whether to keep him stabilized and wait the estimated 15-20 minutes for ambulance.

For one, he may have died if we waited. Two, who knows when exactly the ambulance would have showed up. I know initially I asked the MD in our group "do we keep him here, stabilized" We came to a consenscus: get him down the canyon, Kudos to little brother Cisco on that too for chiming in with "get him in the hands of professionals as soon as possible".

So.... Get that person to med pros asap. As long as it doesnt put anyone in further danger. We also had a lead car dedicated to flagging the passing ambulance, great call. Nice drivin Todd G.

adrock is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-19-2005   #62
Amsterdam, Netherlands
Join Date: Oct 2003
Posts: 272
hey.. we need to get the crew back together sooner than later. i'm tired of loosing sleep over this. and if the boys from Minnissota (Zachman and the blond dude) are reading this let us know so you can be invloved too. i'm sure it's eating you guys up and that's no way to spend a road trip.

i'm available tonight (was planning on running the Source but this is on top the priority list) or any night next week.

Matt- I lost your number, PM me with your cell.

"I would drag my balls across broken glass just to hear her fart into a walkie talkie" -Jay Drury
tboner is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-19-2005   #63
Join Date: Dec 2003
Posts: 168
I second the motion to do this now. I will be leaving for a week to Durango area and I would like to do this before we go and before my memory becomes even foggier. I was planning on running Eldo but this is more important. Tonight would be good for me, Friday less so as we would like to be on the road. I would like to do this even if we can only get the Denver/Boulder guys together, worst case scenario. Ned, can you tear your self away from Summit? You made the right call brotha. I think all critical decisions were made correctly despite any arguing that might have taken place; the fact that Ryan is alive is a reflection of that. My email is My cell is 303-669-4543.
bigboater is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-19-2005   #64
Lewiston, Idaho
Paddling Since: 1997
Join Date: Jul 2004
Posts: 21
Like Ted, I apologize for not posting sooner, but I have had limited computer access this week. I am the MD in the eddy below, mentioned in Todd's original post.
I was just downsteam when the accident happened. We saw a bunch of throw ropes fly, and waited to see if everything was OK. About 2-3 minutes after we saw the throw ropes, we saw people doing CPR. We got my boat and ran upstream. I ferried across the river to assist with resucitation. I got there roughly 5-7 minutes after Ryan was pinned (I think). His face and neck were dark purple, and he was breathing once every 10 to 12 seconds. I couldn't feel a pulse in his neck, but after we cut away his drytop I could feel pulse of about 60 beats per minute in his wrist. In effort to get as much oxygen to his brain as possible, I continued intermittent rescue breathing for another 5 to 10 minutes. I think it is important to point out, although he was breathing, additional mouth to mouth was necessary. 5 or 6 breaths per minute isn't sufficent for a post drowning victim. As his color started to slightly improve, we started trying to figure out how to get him across the river. Fortunately, as already stated, Mike had flagged down the tool truck, so we didn't have to carry or ferry him across. By the time we got him across, his breathing rate was better, and his color continued to improve. By the time we got him to EMS he was starting to regain a little bit of consciousness. It seemed to me, the first EMS didn't have oxygen with them, but the second truck arrived about 2 minutes later.
One thing I will do differently. I am going to buy a plastic face mask to carry with me at all times. This is my second experience with nonhospital CPR (first was not boating related). I have been meaning to get one for years. I'll post how to get one of these in the future. The masks are supposed to get a little better seal. More importantly, the respirations are blown into a small tube, instead of the persons mouth. It should to be easier also, so with a limited number of resuers, it will be less tiring.
I think carrying one of these could prove much more useful than any kind canned air etc.
I would like say extend congratulations to everyone involved. I don't think a rescue could go much more smoothly or efficently.
alan is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-19-2005   #65
El Flaco's Avatar
Golden, Colorado
Paddling Since: 1984
Join Date: Nov 2003
Posts: 1,879
Here's a link to a site that sells Laerdal Pocket Masks ($10), as well as tons of other medical supplies. A pair of EMT shears is $3, and they can cut through anything (including skirts, drytops, even pennies) without a risk of cutting the victim.
El Flaco is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-19-2005   #66
Join Date: Jan 2005
Posts: 305
Here is a link for the pocket mask so you can see what it looks like.
If you choose to get one get it with the o2 fitting a few pennies more but worth it if needed.

You can get them at any Scuba shop, shop local help support local businesses.
Don't do anything, just stand there.
rasdoggy is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-19-2005   #67
US Army Officer
Join Date: Nov 2003
Posts: 10
I'm certainly glad to hear Ryan is recovering, and my hats off to the teamwork that saved him. This is a great thread...all of it! Members of the rescue team being open and talking about how they could have improved on the great work they did...I look forward to Ryan's comments and what he can share that might help others.

Talking about how a "quick air" or a simple hose might have helped in this situation is also important. Just talking about the options and limitations are extremely valuable.

My disclaimer, I'm not on team Rapid Air. My comments on "quick air" are based completely on my experience with the product. I've been playing around with a "Quick Air" for about 8 months.

No doubt Quick Air has limitations, just as Livingston describes; you cannot purge the the hose of water by blowing out. But you realize the limitations and learn the work arounds easily with just a little practice.

Gary E. is correct that you can purge a tube full of water by sucking it through the mouth piece and blowing it out the valve or just spitting it out (easier). It might actually be easier than purging a similar length of hose because once the water is out of the QA hose you are breathing good air instead of your exhaled breath that purged the water. I've done this also at the point of being almost completely out of is much tougher, but doable.

The fact that you can take your mouth off the QA valve and the hose doesn't fill up is invaluable. The thumb trick doesn't work very well on a simple hose so you usually end up having to purge. QA allows you to move to work yourself free and come back and get a breath when you need it.

I've also practiced breathing through it taking on some surface splashing through the tub. I would get about half a mouthful of water but had no pbm getting a full breath. It was like taking sips of air when your "working" a mystery move. When doing this partner assisted you can pretty much eliminate " accidental water" by the person assisting simply cupping their hands around the top of the hose.

The short coming I think that limits quick airs affectiveness is the length of hose. Limiting the lenght by the max depth one can use this at is not seeing other possible scenarios. Scanerios such as being trapped by a strainer or undercut where horizontal distance and not depth prevents the end of the hose from reaching the surface.

So how much more length should be added? A good rubber coupling could allow for an "extension hose" of say...six feet. Not sure if much more than that could be fished under something.

Quick Air is definatley worth the money as it is in my opinion, but nothing is as valuable as good decision making and a strong group. Again my hats off to the rescue team, great work.

Tim Kelley
AW Safety Chair
Tim Kelley is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-19-2005   #68
gapers's Avatar
Not a river guide, Ft. FunK
Join Date: Feb 2004
Posts: 276
They sell the pocketmask at Jax for 25$

gapers is offline   Reply With Quote

Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off

Similar Threads
Topic Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Middle Narrows Anyone? teletumbler Whitewater Kayaking 5 07-31-2006 04:33 PM
Poudre Drowning dzader Whitewater Kayaking 27 06-30-2006 11:08 AM
Log on Middle Narrows on the Poudre Force River Access & Safety Alerts! 0 05-12-2005 12:15 PM
Can poudre narrows be run at 170 cfs? goatboater Whitewater Kayaking 3 08-19-2004 04:09 PM
Wood in Middle Narrows JJH River Access & Safety Alerts! 0 05-27-2004 03:20 PM

» Classified Ads
Pyranha Burn 3 Medium

posted by Rendezvous River Sports


Jackson SuperStar

posted by bodhizafa

Jackson Superstar kayak, black color. In ok condition. ...

Jackson Karma Large

posted by Mmcquillen

2016 L Karma, used for 1/2 a season. Bought it new in July...

Powered by vBadvanced CMPS v3.2.3

Our Communities

Our communities encompass many different hobbies and interests, but each one is built on friendly, intelligent membership.

» More about our Communities

Automotive Communities

Our Automotive communities encompass many different makes and models. From U.S. domestics to European Saloons.

» More about our Automotive Communities

Marine Communities

Our Marine websites focus on Cruising and Sailing Vessels, including forums and the largest cruising Wiki project on the web today.

» More about our Marine Communities

Copyright 2002-2012 Social Knowledge, LLC All Rights Reserved.

All times are GMT -6. The time now is 09:13 PM.

Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.8 Beta 1
Copyright ©2000 - 2016, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.