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Old 04-20-2009   #11
Dipshit with the most.
carvedog's Avatar
Bellevue, Idaho
Paddling Since: 1991
Join Date: May 2005
Posts: 2,497
Originally Posted by Berger View Post
Thanks guys for the beta. I will be super cautious about wood hazrards, especially on Marsh Creek. Shortbus, it seems like you guys were able to put down some damn good mileage in a day. I guess it make sense for how fast the current flows. For you kayakers, what did you guys use for fire pans and porta potty's? I was thinking about just bringing a tupper wear container for the porta potty and maybe creating something out of sheet metal for my fire pan. I'm not sure though.
Pretty sure you can use the PETT bags for the toilet.

Phillips Environmental Products Inc.

or something like that. Call the ranger to make sure. Rick is there for a bit longer and Donna is really nice too. Both good rangers and I ain't no big fan of the Gummint.

There are pit toilets at Dagger, Boundary, Indian Creek, Loon Creek, Flying B and ???? must be forgetting a couple. With a little planning you can not have to carry too much of the "goodness" down river with you.

For a firepan

Salmon-Challis National Forest - Recreational Activities

and don't forget the ashcan. Don't worry about metal for that, I use plastic buckets even with the raft and just put a little water in and let it cool down if you have a fire in the morning.

You will need a tiny little shovel and strainer too. You can improvise ( nylons or old capilene can be a strainer don't ask me how I know ), somewhere on the FS site is a list of the requireds. There will be a ranger at Indian Creek and you can refill water there, although you will no doubt have a filter. Easier that way. Carry less water, more beer. You can buy beer at the Flying B, hard liquor I'm not so sure. never ran out at mile 64 before.

You should be getting your permit letter too, which will have all that info too.

A month away. Good for you.

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Old 04-21-2009   #12
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Join Date: Jun 2006
Posts: 128

Yeah Berger, I am not sure why we were so hell bent on getting to Sheepeater the first day, but We were all conservative boaters and were very cautious and still had plenty of time to explore, eat, soak, etc... The next camp was at the confluence of Big Loon Creek and the next night was at the Ponderosa??? campsite, assigned to us by the ranger at Indian creek. Then out through impassable canyon the last day.

As for fire pans, we had an aluminum turkey roasting pan, and we did end up using it the last night. We took ashes w/ us in tupperware containers. Wag Bags, or like Carvedog stated, PETT bags are the best way to go as the groover alternative. In fact, I just bought some at Wal Mart that are RV toilet liners for half the price of wag bags and are exactly the same thing. The ranger passed our breakdown paddle blade as a shovel, (the paddle was also our tent pole for a mega-mid). I also brought along a piece of a shake-n-bake blanket that is a forest fire fighter protection tarp as a fire blanket and she said that was acceptable as well.

Buy a piece of cheesecloth to use as your strainer. I just came back from grand gulch and used it there for the same purpose

P.S.- scotch packs particulalry well and is a great compliment to the hot springs and the second dinner of the evening...

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Old 04-21-2009   #13
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Evergreen, Colorado
Paddling Since: 1991
Join Date: Jan 2009
Posts: 44
I'm a little slow on responding to this one since we didn't have power for a few days, but here is my take. First, call me cautious but a 2-kayak self-support trip down Marsh/MF seems a bit sketchy especially if you have never paddled with gear before. Maybe loading up the kayaks with all of your gear and running a few laps on the Gorge would be a good idea to give you a feel for how your boat will handle? Just don't feel that you have to push it just because you got a permit. Many permits will likely become available as people begin to drop out because of high water. Running higher water from Boundary when more folks are around might be prudent.

As stressed in the posts above, Marsh and MF can and most likely will contain real hazards. The link below tells the not uncommon tale of Marsh Creek adventures.

Marsh Creek Log - May 2005

I launched on Marsh May 17,2002 and the (old) MF gauge was 4.25' and it was 5.6' when we took out on May 20. Yes the miles add up fast. We were mostly a group a catrafters so my perspective is from this view point. Marsh moves really fast with nonstop maneuvering and around one blind corner we encountered a river-wide tree similar to that described in the link above. Fortunately there was just enough water over the tree to float above it between the exposed branches. A little less water and this would not have been the case.

There is another rapid just below Dagger and we set safety both below Dagger and below the next rapid. You won't be able to do this for your brother and if he is swimming at Dagger it could be a real problem if you can't catch him with a rope. As pointed out above, Marsh and/or MF kills someone every year or two so make sure you are weighing all of the risks. This is indeed an awesome trip, just not one to be taken lightly.

Here are some pictures of my run through Dagger to give you and your brother an idea of what it is like at 4.25'. Enjoy, be safe and don't forgot your dry suit.
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Old 04-21-2009   #14
Orem, Utah
Join Date: Apr 2009
Posts: 3
Send a message via Yahoo to Marlon Ifthikar
It is interesting it seems that Kayak is really a good sports to learn. The adrenalin rush when you where in the rapids would be so exciting.
Nashville Limousine
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Old 04-21-2009   #15
Fort Collins, Colorado
Paddling Since: 2003
Join Date: Mar 2009
Posts: 41
Thanks ShortBus for the info. I'll keep what you used in mind. I've heard a lot of bizarre ones, like a tire rim for a fire pan, but that seems awfully heavy. Thanks for the cautious post Ever-Cat. The river is long, remote, and the water will be high. One of the main reasons why I posted this forum was to get an honest assessment of what lay ahead. I ran the Royal Gorge last weekend, but without gear. We did hike the shuttle though, sucked. I am going to try and do a one night, two day, run down gunny gorge this weekend since my dry bags just got here, so I'll see how it feels. Thanks again for bringing to light the actual circumstances.
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Old 04-23-2009   #16
Fort Collins, Colorado
Paddling Since: 2004
Join Date: Sep 2004
Posts: 21
The post under RioGoodTime above was by Berger. Sorry, I was just on my brothers computer. But thanks again you guys for all the info on everything.

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