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Old 03-12-2014   #11
dirtbagkayaker's Avatar
Bazzaro, World
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Posts: 1,324
From reading the post, it seems the goal is not stop the damn but just to make sure it is of reasonable size.

I'm good with that. It seams to be a reasonable trade off.

I signed it.

Bound is boatless man
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Old 03-12-2014   #12
God Amongst Men
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Phuoc My, Da Nang, THE 'NAM
Paddling Since: 1845
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Originally Posted by caseybailey View Post
7,000,000,000 (7 billion) people on the planet.
And that number is always increasing every day.

Not enough resources to go around.

Here is the problem: I get your passion, and desire, to help. Its a moving story. Steve Fisher has long been a hero of mine, and it sucks to see him, and everyone else affected about to get fucked. But bottom line, these dams are approved, constructed, and operated by the governments and power companies, and they really are going to do what they want. If they are ready to go ahead and move heaven and earth, and displace your 8,000 people, then a petition (ie, a piece of paper) with a handful of names of dirtbag boaters [no offense buzzards.....but go take a shower sometime] scrawled on it isn't even going to make them bat an eye. Hell, even if the President of the United States himself put his name on it, in the end, it is still the sovereign lands of a another country. They can, and will, do whatever the hell they want, if they decide it is in "their" ( ie, gov'ts n power co's) best interest to do so. I know that some random successes have been had to reduce project sizes, but those have been random and small victories, and thinking its always going to work like that is quaint. They complained in S America, first in Chile, and now in Brazil, dont build it, save it! And they built it. They said it in Asia, in China, in India, and right now is Laos, dont build it, save it! And they built it. And right now in Africa they are saying dont build it, save it! Well.....you get whats coming next.

I admire your enthusiasm, but like doughboy said, sometimes you have to focus your energy on things and issues that have real potential for change here in our area. Well, your area right now, because I'm in Asia, not the valley at this moment. But you know what I mean. Put that energy into the access conflict on The Gate section of the Lake Fork, and their fences over the river. Volunteer to help with AW or CW or any of the local paddling clubs around the state. There are always issues popping up everywhere.

Its human to feel sympathy for those affected by these shitty projects, but its also human to know your limit and understand where to be putting that energy.

To be clear, I am against dams. I think they don't provide enough benefits to outweigh their impacts, but I also understand that hydropower is a fairly cheap and appealing to governments, especially in poor, developing countries. Its an awkward situation. Like I said, sometimes we just have to deal with realities, with whatever shape they may be in.

"Don't f$&@ing eddy out, just run it! Whaddya doin??" -LMyers
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Old 03-12-2014   #13
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Also worth pointing out, it is the White Nile that is threatened, not The Uganda river.
"Don't f$&@ing eddy out, just run it! Whaddya doin??" -LMyers
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Old 03-13-2014   #14
Denver, Colorado
Paddling Since: 1995
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Some small number of highly efficient hydro projects that are demonstrably needed and beneficial and built in the most conscientious manner makes sense.That is not what you will get if the profit motive is involved.

Once it is gone it is gone, for at least the foreseeable future.
http ://www.beiizeadventure.com /2011/01/Macal-river-history

Once the unnecessary damn dam was built they jacked up the utility bills on the locals.
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Old 03-13-2014   #15
Denver, Colorado
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link doesn't 't work ....search Macal :A river lost. If interested.
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Old 03-13-2014   #16
golden, Colorado
Paddling Since: 1997
Join Date: Oct 2012
Posts: 35
A few things to remember here:

As someone who'd now done 5 trips to the Nile, I'd like to point out a few things:
1. Money has changed hands, papers have been signed, bribes have been payed, and a dam will definitely be built here...the petition is to encourage them to build the smallest of the 3 sizes of dams that they are considering, which will LEAST affect whitewater and tourism.
2. None of the money or electricity created by the dam project will go to the local people in Uganda, due to the Chinese company building and operating the dam, and the fact that the power is slated to be sold to Kenya.
3. If they decide to build the largest of the dam options, this has the potential to cripple a huge chunk of tourism money for the entire country: In addition to the local economy, which is dependent on whitewater tourists, many "explore Africa" trips will simply no longer come to Uganda if the whitewater bases in Jinja aren't available. Jinja (Uganda) is a "jumping off" point for many of these trips to base and branch out to other Ugandan safaris and experiences. Many of these trips have said that the death whitewater in Jinja would likely mean that they'd no longer run their trips through Uganda at all.
4. Dam projects in places like this are very different animals to ones here....corruption in government and no accountability to the local people who are not necessarily living in the information age changes the playing field. It's just too easy for greedy powerful people to do whatever they want with no checks and balances (and in a part of the world that's lived this way for thousands of years). It's sad, but true. Despite our nations MANY political failings, projects like this in the states are subject to environmental scrutiny transparency that just doesn't exist out there.

SO despite the fact that it's hard to get factual information anywhere about this, it seems as though there is still hope that a smaller dam could be chosen. There are lots of other surveys and studies being done by the government and many other groups on this issue. This petition is just a small piece of a big puzzle, but it's really all we can do at this point and doesn't take much time or energy.

Hope that helps a bit! Thanks for reading!
Stephen Wright

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