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For those who like it wet....Paddle a Dagger

4K views 11 replies 8 participants last post by  mvhyde 
#1 ·
I'm a boater that has gotten over 100 days a year, for the past 6-7 years. I have been privelaged to get to know some dagger connections, therefore I have been buying dagger boats. At the beginning of the summer, I bought a brand new Nomad 8.5. What I didn't realize is that it's not just Dagger's play boats, ALL DAGGER BOATS LEAK!! What the *&%$#@ Dagger. A creek boat, less than an hour run, and no rolls..... equals 15 squeezes of a sponge to get dry. Complete BS!!

Oh, my realization of this "wet" factor came when I bought a used Jefe (LiquidLogic) that had been pinned for a while. Scratched, scarred and beat on, the Jefe is 14.5 sponges less "wet" than the Dagger hunk of shit. I say down with corporate kayaks, use gear that works and as a boater I am proud to start spending a little more on the smaller companies that are taking this sport to a new level (like LiquidLogic). Whaddya Think about that?
 
#4 ·
Aaron you don't even live here any more. Keep your orange county opinions to yourself. He is right, a different skirt will probably help. I paddle a dagger boat and love it. But is leaks like a huge sieve. So i siliconed the screws and we have been experimanting with lining your cockpit rim with a bike tire tube. so you create a rubber on rubber seal for your cockpit. My friend Eric did this, and his boat is dry as a bone. And by the way the dagger boat is worth the effort, the Crazy 88 rocks.
 
#5 ·
The screw holes barely leak, if at all. The problems are the shape of the cockpit-sides are too straight and do not stretch the skirt, I bought a new tight skirt this season. That did not help! Also, the slots in the sides to accomodate the webbing for the backband are a bad idea. This, I think, Is where most of the water comes in. Anyone agree to these points?
 
#6 ·
oh Kid, its so nice to hear from you. The cockpit fix might be worthwhile but most of all I'm just glad to see you actually have a purpose for all that rubber in your wallet. I heard that there is a new yahoo group for virgin kayakers in the 303. Email the Harold "Harry" Balzak at cantfindanythingwet@yahoo.com for more info. They can be found on any given weekend playing in confluence. Their slogan is "Confluence where we can catch STDs just like CU students". And during the week they meet at Golden for slalom where the slogan changes to "Poles we actually know how to use". You'll fit in great if you can convince them that you actually are a front ranger, it might be difficult given that you are improving so much. The virgin part shouldnt be tough for you to convince them of.........

-aaron
 
#7 ·
Yeah, I've tried Snapdragon, Perception, and recently IR spray skirts for a leaky dagger, and nothing seemed to be dryer than the other. I also heard that Wave Sport has been recently bought out by the whole dagger/perception/confluence whatever company they are.
It's screwed up that we as consumer's buy a retail boat around $1,000 and then we have to put silicone and rubbers all over our boat to make it perform like they advertise. Dagger advertises their freestyle boats are designed for all the new moves, but if you're aggressive enought to be trying these moves, then you'll be breaking backbands and trashing the insides of your boat. What the hell was the whole "penis pump" idea with the hip pads, those broke in the first week. And now I've seen the "pump" in jackson boats. EJ, you've got some great ideas, but this was a bad copy
 
#8 ·
Sorry to hear about the issue. I too have had some very leaky boats in the past. However, this year I have been much drier. Took out the screw holes below water line which helped a ton. I also agree on the pump. Im glad it is gone. The new outfitting is way better and lighter as well. And yes, you can throw huge tricks in the 88. As for my Nomad, it's dry as a bone and runs big shit.

hobie
Dagger Kayaks
 
#10 ·
Jaxxon hit it dead on. The shape of the cockpits causes your skirt to have a small gap / weak spot where the seat straps are going through the side of the cokpit rim. Those holes coupled with the bad fit = lots of leakage. I went with a little bigger skirt for my 88 and it's working out pretty well. Since there's a bit less tension on the skirt, it doesn't pull away from the cockpit rim as much. You can also use paddle wax underneath the cockpit rim in that area to create a bigger lip for your skirt to grab onto.

Thing is, Dagger had some weaknesses to address with last years outfitting and I think they did a great job of it. I'm hoping they do the same with next years boats as well.

Eric hit it dead on with the cock(pit) ring he came up with though. I think he's got a prototype model he's looking to maybe manufacture. I just built mine today and it's soooooo dry.

Aaron....go easy on my little buddy. He can't spell very good, but he sure as hell can throw down & make you look silly even if we were to blindfold him, tie his hands behind his back, and pull his skirt.
 
#11 ·
Thanks there big buddy. I'm just a little dude. I can't spell for shit. And yes dagger and wavesport are the same company, but when you think of perception do you think corperate kayaking. I don't know, I don't. That is just the way i look at it. they are a now smaller cog in a now huge wheel. And wavesport and wilderness systems is now the axis of said wheel. Just the way i see it.
 
#12 ·
Daggers do leak... way too much

In paddling a Mamba abd comparing it to my trusty old Gradiant, the newer boats leak a lot. Same thing happened with the Crazy 88 I demoed and wrote a review on.

Sorry Hobie, but Dagger has seriously got some work to do in addressing this. If they''re going to insist on putting holes in the hull, they might want to consider using compression gaskets, not just the nylon & rubber washers. The compression gaskets are cheap and should last many seasons. They can be a bitch to put in without the proper tool, but once you get them in, you will never get water through the hole again.

The ones I use on all of my boats is an aviation grade thru-hole gasket grommet that is normally used for thru-hole bolts that breech a pressurized hull. I add a little caulking as backup to it. Results are no leaks.

And while I'm at it here, why can't Dagger/Wave Sport come up with a better footbrace system? I've been retro-fitting my boats with the Jackson Happy Feet and Happy Seats....makes even the shittiest boat feel nice and comfy.

The one good thing I can say about Dagger is that with the Gradient, they made a winner, even if it is a heavy beast of a boat. That hull is still one of the single most fastest in terms of speed and quick turning ever made, too bad the whole world went mad and threw away the rounded hulls.
 
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