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Old 10-31-2005   #11
placerville, Colorado
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there is video of some of the upper e fk. san juan, anyone got beta on that? the tunnel of love is on wolf ck., which has class 6 potential.

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Old 10-31-2005   #12
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yeah, wolf creek has mighty potential....its woody but its majorly doable.

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Old 11-01-2005   #13
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Nice thread.

A lot of boaters have scouted sections of Upper Wolf Creek, but everyone is pretty scared. More than a few notable creekers have called it unrunnable. I think you could do about 1/4 mile above the 60 footer and then eddy out literally at the lip. But everything below that just gets huge. It's either completely unrunnable, or kinda unrunnable. But maybe someday... I do think their might be some sections if you figure out where to hike in.

People have been eyeing Needle creek for years now, but as far as I know no one has really had the chance to get up in there. Logistically it's either complicated (as in self support, set up base camp, hike up), or an extremely long day. One of the Chamberlain's told me that he hiked it and would see the most beautiful 20 footer, and if you plugged it you would resurface directly under a log. Tons of shit like that, where it's almost runnable but not quite. That being said Chamberlain's a little old school, so it might go.

Evan Ross said they went in and ran the Upper Florida at low flow a few weeks ago. Plan was to do it low and get a feel for it at river level, so when it goes next spring they'll know the lines on the walled in stuff.

If you are willing to do some recon and hike there are some nice mini gorges in the upper Cimarron forks. I've only backpacked the area a good 7-8 years ago, and I remember some wood issues. Good narrow drops though.

In my opinion most of the first D's that haven't been found that still have potential to become 'classic' runs are in the San Juan's, and even most of that shit has been explored. The new frontiers are in NM, AZ, WY, and slot canyons in UT.

Kyle McCutchen
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Old 11-01-2005   #14
KVBA TV8 Vail weatherman/Colorado Kayaker, Colorado
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Corey Volt ran some rather sick creek that I had not heard of in the Ark area this summer. Anyone know what it is? I will try to find out from him. It might be one of these.

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Old 11-01-2005   #15
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I always thought the grand lake area had some potential. North Inlet Creek is pretty big by front range standards and has some serious gradient but it has been 10 years since I hiked in there. A few years ago I hiked Buchanan Creek and Cascade Creek a little further south. Buchanan creek has a mile at about 400' that looked a lot like the source but w/ more volume. Cascade Creek has some 60'ers that land on rocks but above that looked like a 1/4 mile of borderline V++ stuff that looked like it might be runnable.
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Old 11-01-2005   #16
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In the rio grande basin

i've also scouted

BEAVER CREEK - a few sick class v drops right below the beaver res then class 3 boogie water for 3-4 miles until it hit the SF of the Rio Grande. WoodyNeeds to be cleaned. i've heard white water running in the river above the rez but have yet to scout.

ARCHULETTA CREEK. one sick looking class V+ drop with a few other class v drops and some class 3/4 boogie water. has majos wood issues.

i was going to get out there this fall to clean some of theses but my knee if screwed up right now.

of all the ones i've scouted the rio grande above the res looks like the most fun. several class iv/v drops. probably will never be on par with Bailey, the upper A,the BC of the Gunninson, or Embudo etc. but looks like fun.

CLEAR CREEK gets virtually drained by a diversion shortly after the falls, otherwise it would be really good

if anyone's in the area next spring give me a shout. some will also need some serious wood cleanup before they're ready.
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Old 11-01-2005   #17
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i think theres a few good areas left in the state that have potential....

As for Corey Volt, i dont know what creek it could be. The only Ark creeks i know about are..

N Fork S Fork Arkansas has a lot of gradient but a couple clean gorges with some medium to big features. Flow is an issue as it is high. S Fork S Fork Arkansas from Monarch ghost town to below Garfield looks promising, but woody. It could go very easy. M Fork S Fork Ark above Garfield might have something further up, i dont know. Browns Creek has at least one three-stage waterfall that could go, and the potential for more higher up. Chalk Creek has three sections- and IV+/V- fast boulder bed Upper by Romley; a mild III-IV Middle by St Elmo, and a IV/IV+ Lower from just above Mt Princeton Hot Springs. Cottonwood Creek is runnable from below the confluence to Buenie; there is one scary death trap falls-to-culvert in town though. South Cottonwood Creek has been reported to have runnable sections below and above Cottonwood Lake, although access would be sketchy at best. Main Cottonwood Creek is runnable (although mighty woody) from the C.G. above Rainbow Lake to the lake itself, and from Rainbow Lake to the confluence. Someone said Ptarmigan Creek has potential but it would have to be really bedrock-ish as the flow would be minimal. The South Fork of Lake Creek has been run and has some good features, but reports of dangerous shit in the water abound.

in the juans/pagosa area...

We backpacked up needle creek a couple summer ago and camped just below chicago basin proper, there is a long bedrock section (~1.5 mi) up there that is classic, CA style creekin with a low volume. I was really wishing i had a boat. A lot of creeks in the juan that are only accessible by hiking have potential. Flint Creek and Lake Creek on the Los Pinos, as well as two sections on the Los Pinos itself (Upper; South Canyon to Flint Creek and Lower; Falls Creek to Lake Creek) both look like they have potential. There is what looks like at least an 80'r on the Upper. Weminuche Creek on the other side of the range from the Los Pinos, drops through a deep canyon from below the confluence of the E and W Forks to the flats, but flow may be an issue. After the flats, it goes through a canyon before joining the Piedra in the Box Canyons; i have never been into this canyon or seen pics of it so i have no idea there. Middle Fork Piedra looks promising with a deep canyon about a mile above the campgrounds. The East Fork Piedra has a lot of potential; it is a large drainage that represents most of the main Piedra's flows. There are two sections, an upper with a lot of gradient and a lower that isnt as steep, but there is Piedra Falls, where the whole rver blasts through a six foot wide slot. I was there a number of years ago; my memory says it lands in a pool, but i could be wrong. From below these falls to the Williams Creek Rd has lots of potential. Turkey Creek looks good on a map, but that doesnt say much. The Conejos has a couple forks that i would like to take a closer look at. The S Fork looks like it has a short but possilby good canyon that starts about a mile above the main river. The Middle Fork has at least one waterfall on it, it may have more, but flow may be small. Goose Creek into the Rio Grande looks like it has enough flow to do something. The Navajo River SE of Pagosa looks like it has the makings of a good run- geology, gradient, and scenery, but it has a shitty drawback- access. Not only is it on the Tierra Amarilla Land Grant (read: Brazos), the only road up the vally is to a private ranch. Access, scouting, and/or portaging would be difficult. The Rio Blanco looks like it might have something doable higher up- this one may be full of brush and barbed wire though. Clear Creek of the Rio Grande may be runnable above the falls- from the dam to the flats of 149, although this is purely conjecture. Just over the pass, Cebolla Creek has a very heads up upper section through a narrow V/V+ish ravine with a few portages and a lot of wood. Also in the Lake City area, the Lake Fork above Lake City has four distinct sections- Lake to Lake, a mostly easy run through private property with two portages (one around the 60' Argenta Falls and the other around a dam); 3 Gorges, a short section with three (duh) small gorges that have runnable water in them. Its not feasible to boat in between due to brush and the 'beav. Cinnamon Gorge was ran this summer, it has at least a ~50'r a well as two V+'s right below it and a whole slew of continuous and woody V above it. The stretch from American Flats to Burrows Park is mostly unrunnable to due wood, but there three or four sections of runnable falls along the way. Middle, Upper, and Upper Upper Henson were talked about earlier this year (look in my personal picture folder). N Fork Henson might have low volume potential due to similar geology nearby. Just over the divide, theres two gorges between Animas Forks and Eureka on the Upper Upper Animas, one right below A Forks, and the other right above Eureka. The Cinnamon Gorge team reported wood and mining debris; i checked the upper one this summer and it was clean except for one scary drop. I dont know about the lower one. Just over the hill on the Ouray side, the Upper Uncompahgre has potential (albeit steep) in two sections: Poughkeepsie Gulch, and from Mineral Crk to US 550. Red Mountain Creek is super steep, and very rich in zinc, but has max-hair potential. A side fork of Red Mtn higher up has some sweeet micro-volume steep-creeking potential. From Camp Bird to above Box Canyon Falls has some sweet looking box canyons as well as some steep open mank. Getting out before the big falls is key. Potential on the creek just below the big falls (read: Little/Lower Box Canyon Falls). if you could put in at the bottom railing somehow, the creek would be nice to the Unc. Dexter Creek, from just above 550 to the Unc looks mad sick, i want to do it.

the butte area..

Spring Creek has three good sections on it. The Taylor above and just below the res has good potential. Cement Creek has a lower box canyon right next to the right that looks mad runnable, but has a diry sieve at the bottom. The upper portions of this creek might be runnable with a lot of water in it. The West brush creek has some big slides and falls on it, but may not have enough flow or access to get to. The East above Gothic goes over a scary V/VI ish drop and through a scenic and deep but flatwater canyon by gothic town proper. Copper Creek drops over Judd Falls, and may have potential above and below, but water levels would need to be right. Upper Ruby Fork is scary but runnable.

thats my take on it...anyone want to add anything, do it up...
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Old 11-01-2005   #18
Durango, Colorado
Paddling Since: 1996
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Well, I clearly haven't spent as much time on this as yeti, but:
chalk creek has one huge, ugly drop (roadside) but the rest looks boring and woody;
The piedra drainage has the most potential. That river has the most substantial tribs of any river I have paddled in CO (its like being in Northern Cali) plus if the geology of the tribs is like this first gorge of the piedra, it could be really good.
If anyone has run the drop above Gothic on the East, they are batshit insane.
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Old 11-02-2005   #19
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ive only heard that waterfall be called by one name, No Exit Falls, which i can understand.....its nuts for sure.

i agree with the piedra....pidedra and the Los Pinos/Florida drainage. a lot of hiking, but lots of granite.
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Old 11-02-2005   #20
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Damn Yeti, you know your shit.

Browns Creek with the triple drop was run this year by Kyle Hagadorn, but I don't know/doubt if it was a first decent. He said its pretty good to go, although he re-dislocated his shoulder on it (he says it wasn't from the whitewater).

Kyle McCutchen
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