Dropping Numbers

COUNT · 08-16-2005

We ran the Numbers last night for a final Ark run of the season. The flows were roughly 630 when we put on and 300 when we took out. That is a very large change in volume in a channel that size. My question is what similar extreme flow changes have people experienced while on the river?

I've done Deso/Grey's when it was 5000 on day one and 15000 on day six.

I've also paddled the Middle Madawaska in Ontario where there is an agreement between the Dam/Government and the kayak school (Madawaska Kanu Centre) for releasing the water in a spurt from 9am to 3pm thus ensuring all the water is used instead of being wasted in the middle of the night. Flows will jump from about 700cfs to about 1500-2000cfs in about half an hour and will drop just as abruptly at 3:30 in the afternoon.

Just curious.

COUNT

jonny water · 08-16-2005

I ran the French Broad in 96-97 outside of Athens GA and it was 7000 cfs. We surfed all evening and the river rose and fell....the peak was ~20,000 cfs. It was rockin with whole oak trees (roots and everthing) coming down the river.

sj · 08-16-2005

In 83 when I was guiding on the Grand. We tied up in the Mouth of Havasu at about 23k. We hiked Mooney Falls got back at about 4 and it was at about 48k first day of the huge water. I was the second boat to run Lava at the big flows that year. And on the reverse in early 89 we went to bed at about 10 with mid 20's and woke up to a science study flow of 3500. I had purposly stayed above hance And the gorge becuse I wanted to see all the rapids at that low flow. We ran all the way from Unkar to Blaktail at under 4k it came back up at blacktail to the mid twwenties between camp set up and bed. sj

COUNT · 08-17-2005

Awesome!

Ron · 08-17-2005

We used to hike our sportyaks on our heads in at Whitmore in Grand back in the 70's. I've seen it go from 25,000 to 3,000 over night. SJ, who did you work for in Grand?

COUNT · 08-17-2005

That's crazy!

sj · 08-17-2005

Ron I worked for Bill Diamond. I was a lucky enough to get hired when some of the guides fronm the 60's were around and I ran with Bill himself. His first trip was in 56. Then they all retired and I was full time lead my 3rd Summer 84. So it was a cool experience for me. Althouygh it took me a good 10 years to adjust to civilian life. am I talking to Ron Hamblin ? Anyway I have always wanted to do the Whitmore loop.sj

Ron · 08-17-2005

Yep. this is Ron Hamblin. You must have been down Grand when Western flipped a "J" rig in Crystal. I think it was running about 93,000 in 83. I have the honor of being the guy that taught that guide who flipped how to boat. What a teacher, huh? Last time my cousin hiked in at Whitmore and boated out it cost him a $500 fine. I don't know what the status for that trip is now with the NPS. They sure ruined a fun run though. The shuttle was a class V back then. See you. Ron.

sj · 08-18-2005

So you trained young Greg I beleive his name was. I worked at Brianheadsports for 2 winters in the early 80's he worked the rental shop down stairs. Yes I remeber that day vividly. I was clean at crystal in the 70's I beleive but my second cought a peice of the hole and looking at the film later still can't beleive he did'nt flip. 2 days later we were camped at Fishtail high on the right making coffee and we see a western box float by. We gave each other one of those looks. yano that rapid is real and we got lucky. sj

Ron · 08-18-2005

That's Greg Mace. Taught him in school at Kanab. We had an outdoor class. The school dist. bought about 15 sport yaks so for 5-6 years we ran 5 or so trips per year. That's how he got his start. Had about 10 of those students go to work for Western rivers. Andy Schmutz just quit them this year. Had 169 trips so far. Decided with a wife and 4 kids it was time to get a real job. Ron.