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Old 04-10-2007   #31
KVBA TV8 Vail weatherman/Colorado Kayaker, Colorado
Paddling Since: 1992
Join Date: Nov 2003
Posts: 847
Send a message via MSN to hobie
I too am more then disapointed in hearing this story. When I read Alex's name I got sick and mad at the same time. I have known Alex long enough to know he is a good person. Sure he gets on here and ruffles some feathers from time to time but this time was different. I have heard his side of the story and read the one posted here from Glen and had to make a tough decision. After speaking with Alex this morning I have decided to suspend him from the team for 1 year.
I have made some bad decisions in my life. I think we all have. But this was a bit over the top. All I ever ask from my athletes is to be respectable ambassadors to the sport. That did not happen over the weekend and some very bad decisions were made. I can't speak for the others involved but I do know that I like Alex and that he had a lapse in judgement. I was not there so commenting further is pointless. But as the Team manager of Dagger I hold my athletes to a higher standard. I believe Alex will learn from this quickly and be brought back on next year. I know he has already had a rude awakening from this and realizing how much worse it could be. The decision is his. To the others involved I encourage you to think about the words you are slinging at people here. The Colorado paddling community is a great one and your "up yours attitude" is a big insult to many respectable paddlers here. Think about it guys, you were wrong. My apologies to everyone for the actions of one of my athletes and more so, one of my friends. He was in the mix but it is inexcusable.


hobie is offline  
Old 04-10-2007   #32
Golden, Colorado
Paddling Since: 2000
Join Date: Mar 2004
Posts: 490
If anyone knows who these guys are sponsored by, can you please post it or if you don't want to do that, send me a PM and I will. I will also send a letter to their sponsors today asking that any agreements with these people be terminated immediately for breach of faith. This is the most disappointing post I have ever read, but I think it's entirely appropriate that it was posted. Police ourselves or be policed. If they've done it at least twice, then it will happen again.

Wow, I was writing this post as Hobie posted. Hobie, stand up move on your part. I've only met you once, but I think you did the right thing and I appreciate you acting so quickly and decisively.

Schizzle is offline  
Old 04-10-2007   #33
West side, Colorado
Join Date: Apr 2007
Posts: 11
i personally think everybody is over reacting to this situation. I mean i apolagize for drinking glenns tequila but he did leave it by the fire and go to bed....u people need to stop complaining on the internet, i think that getting alex kicked off teams was a horrible choice, alex is a good kid and i have seen him way worse! glenn was the over top... all the other campers there didnt even think that we were out of control except glenn... kyle got up later and started drinking with us....o and if u want to talk to my sponser u can call brent toepper pm me and ill give u his number....all i have to say if u dont like the heat stay away from the fire!
thewestisbest is offline  
Old 04-10-2007   #34
Golden, Colorado
Paddling Since: 2000
Join Date: Mar 2004
Posts: 490
Alleged sponsorships:

Conor Finney - CKS Squad
Alex Holtz - Dagger (formerly), Astral, NRS, Go Fast

These guys aren't kids, they're both older than 18. Time to grow up and learn about consequences and mutual respect.
Schizzle is offline  
Old 04-10-2007   #35
Front Range, Colorado
Join Date: Apr 2007
Posts: 7
An important lesson has been learned here. That is, as a sponsored athlete you are never able to escape the fact that a company now owns your soul. No matter what situation you are in you can be fired! Forget all the rich corporate yahoos, and higher ups that can fly to Bangkok for the weekend ad rape a child, only to come back to work on Monday and make another $1000 deal. Hobie how many times have you gone flying down the road to gore in the wrong lane doing 90, and miss representing dagger? Yes these kids fucked up! To say the least, but we have all been 20, or are going to be, and we have done and will do stupid things! Kicking Alex off the team is outrageous!!! The saints of the kayaking world have handed down the judgment! This person who was disturbed in the middle of the night is and angle! And we must protect him for he has never down anything wrong! Yes these Kids need to learn a lesson, but the lynch mob formed on this forum has crossed the line! Before you ever post this kind of slander on this forum I urge you all to look inside yourself, and see your own faults before you attack the lives of someone else. Hobie, I can't believe the actions that have been taken, after all the things that I have publicly witnessed you do, who can you pass this short of judgment on Alex, or any of the other members of the party? If I were the man in the tent I would have been pissed too! But he needs to observer what his actions have gotten him as well. What has he gained by posting this? They apologized, that is a big step for a kid of twenty to make without being forced to by anyone. He realized the faults of his actions and attempted to correct them before he was ever asked to. He is no Imus! Everyone needs to take this situation in context! How many times everyday all over the world does the campsite next door get to rowdy? Are you kidding me! I don't drink, and I never have. Yet I go to gore fest and put up with the craziness. But that is all in fun, and perfectly normal behavior correct? Is the party atop the Wells Fargo building in Salt Lake at OR acceptable behavior? Shame on you who point the fingers! For if you point a finger it should be at yourself. The Only person you can improve is you, and by doing so you make the world a better place. Correct your own faults before correcting those of others! I urge the lynch mob to take a step back, and understand the parameters under which this situation is opperating. Let cooler head provail, and if you wish to proceed with this one week down the road, do so! But give it time! You are all acting very brashly!!!
Leonidus is offline  
Old 04-10-2007   #36
Seattle, Washington
Join Date: Feb 2004
Posts: 207
Originally Posted by thewestisbest View Post
u people need to stop complaining on the internet
uhhh, ok if you said so..

[quote=thewestisbest;63429]alex is a good kid and i have seen him way worse!quote]

this statement will work wonders for his future sponsorships, which hopefully will be none. good pr!
Yonder_River is offline  
Old 04-10-2007   #37
pnw, Washington
Join Date: Oct 2003
Posts: 3,404
Leonidus, it isn't difficult to look at your IP and find your real id. Own your post and by the way, you are doing exactly what you are accusing everyone else of by questioning Hobies judgement on an online forum
"Yesterday I was clever and tried to change the world. Today I am wise and try to change myself." -Rumi
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Old 04-10-2007   #38
KVBA TV8 Vail weatherman/Colorado Kayaker, Colorado
Paddling Since: 1992
Join Date: Nov 2003
Posts: 847
Send a message via MSN to hobie
If you took the time to read my post you would see that I have acknowledged mistakes I have made. I am fortunate to have lived through some major bad decisions. And Alex was placed on suspension, not booted for good. And the difference is guns, drugs and booze. A lethal mix and one that as a manager I can not accept. I know you guys are all upset now but really the only reason I have to say this in public is due to the nature of the issue. If one of my athletes displays this behaviour I have to take action. I too have lost friends to guns. One was a month ago. A friend of mine from high school was shot in the head by his own sister in the kitchen at a party they were at. Drunk and goofing off and his sister shot him in the eye. Sorry you don't see the point but it is not about you being upset with me. I don't care. And yes, I have made mistakes but as I move forward I learn from them. Alex will do the same. I have spoken with him and he understands. Maybe you should talk with him too and you will understand more. And by the way, "Own his soul"? Never man. I always let the team do thier thing and enjoy the lifestyle. But if thier actions compromise anothers life I can not accept that.
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Old 04-10-2007   #39
Join Date: Dec 2003
Posts: 22
Boater and all the others that Condoned the actions of these punk-assed bitches!

Anyone that would condone the behavior of those guys is a lame and deserves every beatdown that the river dishes out on them. I think their names, photos, SS numbers, addresses, vehicle information etc should be posted. They deserve to have thier asses kicked in!!!, and so do YOU for making bullshit excuses for inexcusable behavior!!!
Fuck you and yours, and if you want to camp like a redneck do it elsewhere!
dregina is offline  
Old 04-10-2007   #40
Join Date: Oct 2003
Posts: 41
raising hell has been a part of kayaking party's since the beginning, but shooting guns never mixes well with booze and the kids should have eased back on that when asked to stop the shooting.
Kayaking has become pretty mainstream these days and not everyone who kayaks likes to party late into the night, the kids involved are still in the process of growing up and are learning to take responsibility for their actions. they should not be looked down upon or beat up at some other camp ground because they made some bad decisions on a friday night.
Alex is a well know kayaker who sometimes like to party a little harder then the rest, but you also need to think about the fact that he like to run the shit a little bit harder then the rest as well and the two go hand an hand. To his credit he did get up in the morning and and apologies for what happened, he offered some money for the booze and replaced the ice that had been used to put out the fire which had been fed by people who had gone to bed.
the situation is unfortunate and the discharge of firearms needs tot stop, but the late night partying will still be a part of camping around kayakers, it may be a good idea to set tents away from the kids if you don't want to hear them.
The kids will learn and grow up but until then they will be kids
have great season of boating

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