Mountain Buzz banner

Dangerous question

17K views 111 replies 48 participants last post by  esp 
#1 ·
Ok, I may be embarking on a very bad subject that more than likely doesn't belong on the buzz. But what the heck....
I'm curious about the political persuasion of boaters. Maybe we could get a little solidarity off the water as well as on.
Quick question that needs a quick answer, no need to go off on this one...

who are you voting for in November :?:
 
#2 ·
Someone less dumb than the current most powerful man in the world...
 
#6 ·
I am going to go out on a limb and say no one will be voting for Kerry, they will be voting against Bush. I probably will vote for Kerry and then I think I will vote for Bush, oh wait... I voted for Kerry before I voted for Bush but now I want to vote for Bush... ah f it.

If Kerry wins I am going to Canada.

GW04

Bryon
 
#8 ·
So if I lie, would theyrespect that? Works for Kerry (or does it). The only good that would come of Kerry being elected is that he would probably be assassinated by one of the Vets that he spit on or lied about within a year. But then again no Dem is a good choice so Edwards would be no better. Hence, Hello Canada
 
#11 ·
This is really a bad subject to try and unify boaters with. If you want to associate only with members of your own beliefs and political party, that's pretty sad and very, very naive. If you feel so much in despair about the state of the world, then get off you ass and go volunteer for someone who needs it. There are plenty of good causes to take your mind off which of two people is going to save the human race. mytc.
 
#13 ·
I personally think that it would be a pretty boring place to be if everyone thought the same things. There are 2 sides to every arguement and somewhere in the middle lies the truth. The only thing I worry about is the saftey of ALL Americans and who is going to provide us the best protection from those that want to hurt us. There are to many things at stake to put someone in office that would try to negotiate with people who have no intention of holding up their end of the bargain. Unfortunatley we are the worlds super power and we have an obligation to the rest of the world to not give in to the terrorists. Someone has to do it, God knows France and Germany wont. (throw Kerry on the same list)

Why would I go and volunteer when I could go and boat.
 
#14 ·
VIOLENCE=VIOLENCE
Don't be a slave to the propaganda of the war machine
WMD=$$$$$$$$$$$$$
WAR=$$$$$$$$$$$$$$
and who is making the most $$$$$$ off Iraq
Chaney= Halliburton
WE THE PEOPLE NEED TO = CHANGE
WE DESERVE MORE THAN A TWO PARTY SYSTEM
DOWN WITH THE ELECTORAL COLLAGE
LONG LIVE TRUE DEMOCRACY
FUCK THE PLUTOCRACY
POWER TO THE PEACEFUL
FIRE THE LIAR
RENEWABLE ENERGY = SUSTAINABLE PEACE
NO LIFE IS WORTH MORE THAN ANY OTHER
MOVING TO CANADA IS NOT THE ANSWER
RISE UP PEOPLE WE CAN MAKE A DIFFERENCE
ONE SMALL CHANGE AT A TIME

Peace and love
MM
 
#15 ·
benrodda said:
bush may be dumb and texan..... but at least he is consistent.

ben
Ben, you are probably being sarcastic. For those that didn't pick up on that subtelty, ask yourself if consistently wrong is better than sometimes right?

Mountain, thanks for the motivation! We've gotta do something besides not vote. Your kids deserve more than putting your head in the sand.
 
#16 ·
Here is something that might unify boaters a little:

If Bush is re-elected he is going to continue cutting down forests, building roads into wilderness, and damming rivers. A vote for Bush is a vote against the rivers,forests, and wildplaces that we kayakers enjoy so much.

Think of it as a vote not for Kerry, but a vote against Bush.

Zach.
 
#17 ·
Those who don't know their history are failed to repeat it.

h2oxtc said:
I personally think that it would be a pretty boring place to be if everyone thought the same things. There are 2 sides to every arguement and somewhere in the middle lies the truth. The only thing I worry about is the saftey of ALL Americans and who is going to provide us the best protection from those that want to hurt us. There are to many things at stake to put someone in office that would try to negotiate with people who have no intention of holding up their end of the bargain. Unfortunatley we are the worlds super power and we have an obligation to the rest of the world to not give in to the terrorists. Someone has to do it, God knows France and Germany wont. (throw Kerry on the same list)

Why would I go and volunteer when I could go and boat.
France already learned the hard way that you can't beat terrorists with violence alone. Ever hear of two countries called Vietnam and Algeria? If you are perceived as an oppressor no matter if that perception is true or false no amount of “preemptive war” will bring you peace.
 
#18 ·
What Bush's re-election would mean to the rivers

wycoloboater said:
If Bush is re-elected he is going to continue cutting down forests, building roads into wilderness, and damming rivers. A vote for Bush is a vote against the rivers,forests, and wildplaces that we kayakers enjoy so much.
ditto.

This is the subject that makes this topic appropriate for the Buzz.
 
#19 ·
Your kids deserve to be alive to have the same freedoms you have... at least mine do. Backing down to terrorists is not the answer, and Kerry doesn't have a "plan" for anything. Would you like the UN to handle our security? Bush has done as good a job as anyone under the circumstances over the past four years. If you want to replace him with a filthy rich, Massachusetts liberal (who's best friend is Teddy "I can't swim" Kennedy), who will no doubt raise your income taxes (If you work, that is) first thing in office, and has NO plan for Iraq or our security, that's your choice. Also, remember that a guy who owns his own Gulfstream, is worth 1/2 a billion dollars, married THREE very rich women for his own cause, owns a fleet of SUVs, probably doesn't really give a shit about your precious environment... and yes that's Kerry.
 
#20 ·
I've got the perfect way to spice up this post, let's bring religion into it. That retard W can't make a speach without talking about his F_cking God. He even said once, soon we will have "our God's peace" in Iraq. Either he is an instigator or an Idiot, I believe both. If you get upset or pissed when you hear Iraqis talk about Jihad, imagine how they feel.

There is a reason people hate us, and it is not because "they are jealous of our freedom" as our leader has often said. The significant portion of the world population is a victim of our leisure... got a meeting to go to, gotta go.

-d
 
#21 ·
wycoloboater said:
Here is something that might unify boaters a little:

If Bush is re-elected he is going to continue cutting down forests, building roads into wilderness, and damming rivers. A vote for Bush is a vote against the rivers,forests, and wildplaces that we kayakers enjoy so much.

Think of it as a vote not for Kerry, but a vote against Bush.

Zach.
Hmmm, that's certainly buying into the Kerry rhetoric, however how does one build a house without trees for wood? How does one fight a forest fire without access to the wilderness? How does a river flow all year without a dam (by the way, all the rivers you kayak on are damned in Colorado and the west, to do otherwise is pure ignorance). The water does not exist for kayaking, and without dams your season would last about a week.

Oh, and to the person who hates God in this forum.. keep it to yourself.
 
#22 ·
how does one build a house without trees for wood
The vast majority of national forest land already has roads in it, let us keep the small and fragmented areas that are roadless!

How does one fight a forest fire without access to the wilderness?
Duh, its a freekin' wilderness! Fire is natural and good for the health of the forest. Currently they generally don't fight fires in wilderness areas, they fight them when they threaten property and homes. Also, have you ever heard of smoke jumpers?

How does a river flow all year without a dam (by the way, all the rivers you kayak on are damned in Colorado and the west, to do otherwise is pure ignorance).
Ever heard of the Yampa? How about the Salmon, or the Yellowstone? Betcha money that if the bush administration could these would be dammed also. And yes I would rather have them running free with a short season than paddling artificial flows in september.

Oh, and to the person who hates God in this forum.. keep it to yourself.
We sortof have a secular government, bush is trying to change that, religion and politics should not mix

that's my 2 cents
 
#23 ·
Let's cut taxes for wealthy and raise spending faster than any modern president
with our tax cuts for the wealthy we can drastically raise the cost of medicaid, spend more money on education than ever before, pass the largest pork barrel farm bill ever, oh yeah and we can wage two wars - don't worry though those tax cuts for the wealthy will pay for themselves --I don't know about you but my taxes are the same

Let's get involved in a war of choice without help of allies

Let' leak the names of CIA agents for our own political purposes

Let's play hide the ball on the true cost of Medicare by coercing employees and using a ploy that has never been used by Congress before and hold the vote open while we twist some more arms -- oh did I say it'd cost $400 billion ooops we really knew it'd cost $550 billion (those tax cuts will pay for that)

Let's not let people buy medicine from Canada b/c it'll hurt our pals in the drug industry

Let's have our good ol' boys from the energy industry tell us how the country's energy policy should go

Let's squelch civil liberties and throw away the constitution -- yeah we can imprison people forever and never give them a trial -- oh really says the Supreme Court - no you can't we still have this thing called a constitution

Let's foster an atomosphere where toture of people is condoned - and no one gets fired over that one?!?!!

Let's vote for Bush if you don't care about the why this country founded, and want an arrogant, ultra-conservative, and ultra-stupid president

If your not outraged you're not paying attention!

Not voting is lame
 
#24 ·
I don't hate God, I hate Bush's God. And W should keep his God out of politics because no one ever backs down from an argument based on faith (because of it's very nature). The leader of the free world should not be proselytizing. I didn't bring religion into this election, W did.

W even asked religious leaders to preach to their congregation and persuade them to vote for him. (Now I'm really going to piss some people off!) I guess he felt his best opportunity for reelection was to target the most gullable of the population.

I can't blame this post on low water, the Big T was stellar last night and I fly to Gauley next week. For those of you who say you are not voting, at least throw Nader bone!
 
#25 ·
Not voting is lame
No matter who you vote for, it is your constitutional right to vote, everyone and anyone who complains, bitches, or otherwise likes/dislikes the President and his policies should vote. If you don't vote you have no reason to complain, you obviously don't care enough about it to spend five minutes in the voting booth. That is five minutes that can change your life and the lives of the people around you in a miriad of ways.

There is no water, nothing to ski, life in Colorado is pretty dreary on Nov. 7 so you have no reason not to vote; besides, it will get you out of work for a few minutes.

Do your part and vote!

Zach.
 
#26 ·
The only thing I worry about is the safety of ALL Americans and who is going to provide us the best protection from those that want to hurt us. There are to many things at stake to put someone in office that would try to negotiate with people who have no intention of holding up their end of the bargain. Unfortunately we are the worlds super power and we have an obligation to the rest of the world to not give in to the terrorists.
To this point- The Bush admin policies are not making us safer abroad of at home. Read a newspaper today and you will see that recent US Intelligence Reports are highly pessimistic about Iraq. Iraq was not the home-front of the war on terror, but it is now and so as it slips from bad to worse we elevate the danger to ourselves and the international community that tried so hard to keep us out of there because they knew it wasn;t about terrorism but installing a free-market economy in a resource rich nation.
- Military brass from both sides of the political fence agree that by diverting human and financial resources from Afghanistan and Pakistan we hurt our chances in the war on terror. Al Qaeda and the Taliban are resurgent there and Osama Bin Laden is loving every minute of this war in Iraq. Imagine how much easier it is to enlist young Islamic men to join against the west when Paul Bremer fired 500,000 state workers in Iraq in time for them to watch as 14,000 CIVILIANS have been killed in Iraq. Are they different than any of us? If you think not just be happy you weren't born in Iraq than in the US.

Hmmm, that's certainly buying into the Kerry rhetoric, however how does one build a house without trees for wood? How does one fight a forest fire without access to the wilderness? How does a river flow all year without a dam (by the way, all the rivers you kayak on are damned in Colorado and the west, to do otherwise is pure ignorance). The water does not exist for kayaking, and without dams your season would last about a week.
-This is a pretty simple look at the relationship between the environment, the economy and resource use. Seriously, is that all it is to you? Of course natural resources are used to enable our quality of life and that is why they need protection and strong management. The Bush administration has headed agencies that were previously charged with that responsibility with lobbyists from the industries that sell those resources for profit. The environmental situation in this country and the world was bleak before the thugs came into office. I fear that in coming decades we will all feel the hurt from the administrations recall of regulations on mining, timber harvesting, pollution controls, curtailing of clean water standards, new definitions of "wetland" that streamline development or exploitation of wetlands, weakening of clean air laws... Seriously one could go on and on. Do you think he does this for you? Or for industry? This isn't just a question of protecting the environment -for alot of folks that just squishy liberal talk right?- this is an issue of public health. Thousands of people die every year in this country from illness related DIRECTLY to dirty air. Over the past 40 years this nation has fought to change that and we were really making progress in maintaining cleaner air and water, they are undoing it. Try turning off Bill O'Rielly and reading about it, its in the public record.

bush may be dumb and texan..... but at least he is consistent
.

No he isn't. First he didn't think Al Qaeda was a threat, then after Sept 11th, he did. Didn't want an independent commission to investigate 9-11 then he did, didn't want a homeland security dept., then he did, didn;t want international assistance in Iraq, then he did.

He says he follows the teachings of Christ. Is he humble? Is he benevolent?

He talks about taking responsibility and being held accountable unless you are a large corporation in which case you need loopholes, cutbacks and rules won't apply.
If anything he consistently misleads the public using hyperbole and vague references to 9-11. Consistent is just not a good way to describe these guys.

He talks about patriotism as though he owns it, but he is trampling the core values of of this country, freedom to speak out, to question, to practice or not practice any religion you choose, to fight for those who can't fight for themselves, to allow everyone an equal opportunity to succeed. The policies and values of this president are not true, in my opinion to those values that make this country great. We are a country that was built on those values and on strong relationships with the international community. That is our strength, cooperation with the international community. Of course its hard working with the UN and other countries because we all have differing interests, but we are part of an international community and our greatest strength lies in the strength of that community. I fear that under this administration we have lost the moral authority that took so long for this nation to build. Now neither our allies or our enemies trust us and we look bad. Don't believe be? Take a trip, Europe, South America, Asia, and ask people what they think. And the amazing part is that they haven't given up on us as a nation. Most people I have spoken with outside the US take care to separate their frustration with our government from their belief that on the whole we are good people.
Internally our strength is our people, not our military. Of course a nation as large as our needs a strong military but we also need to educate our public and that is just one more area where this administration has fallen flat. This goes no and on and I respect everyones position wholeheartedly. Just don't get your info from commercials on TV or nutty TV pundits.
For those who would call this stance weak, thats fine, but I have been to ground zero, and I was at the site of the Bali bombing while the ground was still smoldering and the air reeked. We are fighting ideas not just people and you can't kill idea with bombs.

Hope I didn't rustle to many feathers. xoxo

Clark
 
This is an older thread, you may not receive a response, and could be reviving an old thread. Please consider creating a new thread.
Top